[COM] Victoria Square Upgrade - $24m

[Honey of a City]

These current structures seem to be intended as shade houses rather than arbours. Do they intend to plant climbers on them? If so then we'll know that stages 2-3 are definitely a long way off.

[ml69]

But it's not a waste of the money if it is intended that the current arbours will be recycled and used elsewhere - somewhere in the parklands? I'm thinking Adelaide Oval & environs would be good.

I think a better location would be Hindmarsh Sq or Light Sq, where I believe they would receive greater use than in the parklands around Adelaide Oval.

Combined with an upgrade of Hindmarsh or Light Sq to make them more pedestrian friendly and accessible from nearby office buildings (and improve the attractiveness of the landscaping), the current arbours could make for a pleasant spot for lunch in those squares.

Note that if they are to be used in Light Sq, the current "traffic island" layout would need to be changed for it to work.

[rooshooter]

I go past Vic sq every day and while I'm impressed that finally something has been done there, and it's modern and probably more functional, it is totally unsuited to our climate - the northern half especially of the redesign is a barren heat sink. I know the trees planted will grow - but that will take years before they are useful as shade. I realise mature trees weren't an option - but some sort of plan should have been considered to cool the oven they have created. We live in a dry, hot climate - yet 30-40% of the new square is paving/concrete!
It might work in Europe but has anyone felt the weather lately?
What's the point of a funky new design if it'll be too hot to hang out in during the summer, for what, ten years til the few trees they've put in become mature enough to offer proper shade?
Couldn't there have been some sort of temporary shade provided for more than the 20% apparently covered?
Or some planter trees (like bank st) to help create a milder microclimate?
Damn it, I feel like a naysaying no good type - feel free to flame me but I just feel like we sometimes only get things half right in this town and this is one of them.

[Nathan]

It wasn't exactly shady before. I think between the large shade structures and the water play area, the northern half was much cooler to walk through than it was previously.


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[how good is he]

I agree 100% rooshooter, far too much paving/concrete....while a huge improvement on what was there...nothing much like the lush gardens etc in the fantastic renders....if the amphitheatre was concreted it would be more like our new skate park!

[Ho Really]

I go past Vic sq every day and while I'm impressed that finally something has been done there, and it's modern and probably more functional, it is totally unsuited to our climate - the northern half especially of the redesign is a barren heat sink. I know the trees planted will grow - but that will take years before they are useful as shade. I realise mature trees weren't an option - but some sort of plan should have been considered to cool the oven they have created. We live in a dry, hot climate - yet 30-40% of the new square is paving/concrete!
It might work in Europe but has anyone felt the weather lately?
What's the point of a funky new design if it'll be too hot to hang out in during the summer, for what, ten years til the few trees they've put in become mature enough to offer proper shade?
Couldn't there have been some sort of temporary shade provided for more than the 20% apparently covered?
Or some planter trees (like bank st) to help create a milder microclimate?
Damn it, I feel like a naysaying no good type - feel free to flame me but I just feel like we sometimes only get things half right in this town and this is one of them.

I agree with you. A couple of us have mentioned it already that it has become a heatsink. It won't get much better even when the trees are fully grown. Too much reinforced concrete has gone down.

It wasn't exactly shady before. I think between the large shade structures and the water play area, the northern half was much cooler to walk through than it was previously.

That's because they let the square go into ruin. All they needed to do was move a few things around, underground Wakefield-Grote Streets to extend the square, replace and plant new trees and keep the lawns green. Presto! You still would've had a place for your concerts, etc., but on more grassed area.

Cheers

[rooshooter]

What worries me, is the 2nd/3rd/etc stages of vic sq (redesign of tram line/road etc) will allow existing shade trees (esp north western corner) to be removed, meaning we'll end up with a pretty square, but totally unsuited to our climate.
Like I said, I feel bad - I'm SO happy finally some of the most turgid, run down spaces are getting a work out, but to what end? Surely, surely, the egg-heads designing this stuff for the council are aware of our climate???
The more "greenage", the better.
Green walls, green arbours, planter boxes etc aren't gold plated infrastructure - they're relatively cheap to implement. Cheaper than granite pavers and concrete.
Why aren't we moving hard towards a greener city?
Ok, I'm off to be my usual lurker again! Been a total grumpy greeny today!

[Honey of a City]

I reckon the key to the whole design was in the arbours. If the animation/renders are any guide they'll provide shade, windbreaks, a microclimate, an engaging performance area, and a remarkable sculptural feature. It's great they started the project, and achieved an incredible result in the timeline, which was set by the Tour schedule. Now the key is to press on with the next stage. I still reckon they should have started the proper arbours in the space allowable, and then extended them later. The temporary structures just look temporary and out of place. That's a personal taste thing though I guess. BTW does anyone know when the public will be able to access the site? It was officially opened a couple of weeks ago, and the Tour infrastructure's been removed, and it's still fenced off. The new turf took a mighty pounding during the Tour village and looks pretty ragged right now. Maybe that's why.

[Ho Really]

What worries me, is the 2nd/3rd/etc stages of vic sq (redesign of tram line/road etc) will allow existing shade trees (esp north western corner) to be removed,

[...]

That to me is idiocy at its best. Anyone pulling down mature heathy trees should have their arms pulled off! I'm no greeny but I can't stand redesign for the sake of it when it comes to replacing trees for concrete or ashpalt! Tells you a lot about our destiny as a species.

Cheers

[mgb]

BTW does anyone know when the public will be able to access the site? It was officially opened a couple of weeks ago, and the Tour infrastructure's been removed, and it's still fenced off.

I went through today and the northern half was pretty open (including the road through Wakefield/Grote). They are still removing the Tour structures, but I am not sure how soon they will close off for the Fringe village.

I know that they intend to use Victoria Square for the Fringe but I not seen any designs for the area. Does any one know what it will really be for? Last year they had the old bus depot as a sort of 2nd Fringe location outside of the east end - is Victoria Square suppose to be similar (without the shipping containers) or a totally different concept in addition to the bus depot?

[mattblack]

BTW does anyone know when the public will be able to access the site? It was officially opened a couple of weeks ago, and the Tour infrastructure's been removed, and it's still fenced off.

I went through today and the northern half was pretty open (including the road through Wakefield/Grote). They are still removing the Tour structures, but I am not sure how soon they will close off for the Fringe village.

I know that they intend to use Victoria Square for the Fringe but I not seen any designs for the area. Does any one know what it will really be for? Last year they had the old bus depot as a sort of 2nd Fringe location outside of the east end - is Victoria Square suppose to be similar (without the shipping containers) or a totally different concept in addition to the bus depot?

The Royal Croquet Club will be setting up shop there. An expanded version of the set up they had on the southern riverbank for the ashes.

[Paulns]

I really hope those arbourers are temporary because if you go by the video it appears that in each stage they're progressively installing the intended arbour structure?

It just seems like a terrible waste of time and money to have installed the ones that are there, landscaped and paved around them and then if and when Stages 2 & 3 get up, remove and replace them with the grand arbourers in the original design anyway? Maybe the design had to be changed in Stage 1 to rush the build stage through for the Tour Downunder? I don't know? But what's in the video and pictures and what's there now is definitely not the same.

I agree with what some people have said and think that the original arbourers are what really makes new Victoria Square. They'll provide the shade, grandeur and be a real focal point. I really hope what's there now is only temporary..

I'm no expert and I certainly don't know the plans for each stage but this is how I thought it was going to progress.

Original Layout of Victoria Square.


Stage 1. - (With the intended arbourers?)


Stage 2.


Stage 3. - The finished new Victoria Square?

[Honey of a City]

Agree with you Paulns. There seems to be some mystery about the progress of the stages too, and rationale for the current shade houses. Does anyone know if and where the definitive and current stage plan is available to the public? The ACC's Victoria Square website is out of date. As you say the completed Stage 1 doesn't match the published Stage 1 render.

[thoughtfactory]

I wandered around the northern end early Sunday morning. http://poodlewalks.wordpress.com/2014/0 ... ia-square/ The northern end is more functional and better designed than the old square, but it does look to be a heat trap. I cannot see office workers sitting on the lawn at midday during the summer.

What do stages 2 + 3 of the redevelopment involve? Does anyone know when these are due to start?

[how good is he]

Earlier in the thread I joked that if they concreted the only bit of lawn it could be our new skate park....but now seriously every time I have gone past there are half-a-dozen skate boarders using it as such!