News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

[rev]

What part of its not going to happen do you not understand?

I will eat my hat and pigs will fly before it does.

Some of you really need to stop foaming over absolute impractical nonsensical crap, really.

You've stated your opinion, of it's not going to happen.
I never said it WILL happen. I simply asked WHY NOT, and said there is plenty of room to accommodate a train line to West Lakes.
If you don't think it's going to ever happen, then say why. It's a discussion forum after all.

[Llessur2002]

I'm also a bit confused as the Government's own 30 year transport plan shows the extension of the tram line to be along the route of the existing OH rail line and not down the center of Port Road, yet in the interview he talks about it being impractical to run trams down the center of Port Road. As far as I knew this wasn't the plan anyway - or have I missed something?

That said, whilst I love the idea of an extensive tram network, I am leaning more towards the retention of heavy rail on this line - mainly due to the reduction in travel times for those who live towards the end of the line. Plus, if the feds are going to stump up money for the Torrens Junction grade separation then it seems silly to turn that down.

Prioritise the creation of new tram lines for areas that haven't got rail of any type at the moment - Norwood and Prospect get my votes.

[claybro]

Whilst heavy rail to OH might just be feasable in the future, there is no way spur lines to West Lakes/ Grange and Semaphore whould have anywhere near the patronage to make it worthwhile. By international standards, what we percieve as "high density" developement in West Lakes, is still considered low-medium density in other world cities, and by no means enough mass to support heavy rail, with cars CAPABLE of in excess of 130km/h down the middle of Wst Lakes Boulevarde. Massive overkill. Also, where does Mullighan get the idea of the tram going down the middle of Port Road?....this was NOT part of the plan. the plan was either a dual light/heavy rail corridor utilising the existing OH line, or converting the whole lot to light rail. In light of the absolute confusion of the concept...I would say the whole idea is not even being seriously considered by government, it has all got too hard. Dont be surprised when we are offered up dedicated bus lanes down Port Road as an "interim" measure.

[[Shuz]]

What part of its not going to happen do you not understand?

I will eat my hat and pigs will fly before it does.

Some of you really need to stop foaming over absolute impractical nonsensical crap, really.

You've stated your opinion, of it's not going to happen.
I never said it WILL happen. I simply asked WHY NOT, and said there is plenty of room to accommodate a train line to West Lakes.
If you don't think it's going to ever happen, then say why. It's a discussion forum after all.

It won't happen because:

There's not enough room down the West Lakes Boulevard corridor without seriously adversely affecting the existing traffic management and configuration currently in place.

Cost. Heavy rail is much more expensive per kilometre than light rail, both in capital and operational costs.

Political expedience. Safe Labor seats in the west. They can continue to fuck over the voters and retain the seats in the western suburbs exactly just as they have fucked over the voters in the northern suburbs with the promise of the Gawler electrification.

[claybro]

I do think the OH line will eventualy be electrified, and heavy rail cars which can be used with stock from the other lines. There would hopefully be some amalgamation of stations. But I would be surprised if the Grange spur is done any time in the next 20 years. That being the case, Grange line will become isolated and permanently shut down. It leads nowhere, unlike Tonsley which has further potential. Really, what is the point of a heavy rail line servicing large expanses of golf course, and a couple of low density suburbs. The diesels will be at the end of their useful life by then and so the future of Grange and Belair is grim. I would be most surprised to see any type of rail -heavy or light into Grange/WestLakes and Semaphore road any time soon.I for one would have loved to see a light rail network in the Northwest, having grown up in the area, I think it suits light rail well.

[rev]

It won't happen because:

There's not enough room down the West Lakes Boulevard corridor without seriously adversely affecting the existing traffic management and configuration currently in place.

There's plenty of room. There's no property that prevents the widening of it.

Cost. Heavy rail is much more expensive per kilometre than light rail, both in capital and operational costs.

Think the north-south corridor.
Through Regency Park and up to the PREXY/Salisbury Hwy, they build an elevated road spending close to 900 million.
Through Croydon Park/Croydon/Ridleyton/Hindmarsh they have bought up all the property mostly on one side to make way for widening so a trench can go through the middle. The same will be done further south. If cost was an issue, they'd just build an elevated road through the entire length, and only acquire a few properties around intersections to allow for on/off ramps.

I think it's more likely it wont happen because the government isn't serious about it.

[Norman]

Let's remember that the Integrated Transport and Land Use plan was just a draft that was released in late 2013. I would expect the final version to be released with the state budget, along with possibly some infrastructure spending announcements. No source on that last bit, just a gut feeling.

[claybro]

Interestingly, here in Perth, there is much a furore in my local area regarding the proposed light rail that is planned to go some 22km from the CBD to the mid Northern suburbs. After making this project an election promise, the state government (which now thinks the state is broke) has decided to "defer" the light rail, and instead install a dedicated busway along the same route. Now the light rail proposal, unlike Adelaide, had significant public and media support.The local councils, who smell a rat, are having none of the bus lanes proposal, and refused to support or fund them as they feel that once the dedicated bus lanes are in place, the government will weasel out of the light rail completely. Now the government here is bleating on about congestion and increasing urban density blah blah, Apartment complexes are going up everywhere in the near city suburbs here, and gentrification is changing the main roads into high streets with cafes, boutiques etc. In my experience here, while the bus lanes can be efficient in moving commuters from A to B, they offer no where near the quiet ambience of light rail, which is positioned away from the footpath in the centre of the road, and do not rely on noisy buses.Same goes for light v's heavy rail/ bus ways and the likes of West Lakes/Semaphore etc.

[Hooligan]

Sending a train from Glanville station 1 kilometre down Semaphore road to the foreshore would be completely ridiculous. I could see a tram going down there but in no way can I picture a train doing it. I'm aware there was a train down that road 40 years ago and it's just as unviable now as it was then.

But like others have said, electrify the Outer Harbor line as it is, either close the Grange line or redirect it to West Lakes and that's it for rail in that part of town. In saying that, A tram line to Henely beach with a spur to the airport makes more sense than any other suggestion to me when it come to trams.

[how good is he]

It is an interesting thought mainly because the amount of train track needed would be so short that it could be viably done quickly and cost effectively. Say they did electrify and extend the train down Semaphore Rd and also add a spur line near Albert Park to West Lakes then only 2-3 kms of track would be needed. It's a no brainer if running a tram there are off the table.
The airport and possibly Henley Beach are a lot harder to justify and make work. Hypothetically if electrified train was to be considered, what would be the best possible route?

[Nathan]

For a tram, either Henley Beach Rd or SDB Dr. For train, maybe along Keswick Creek (there would still need to be property acquisition, but probably less than any alternative)

[claybro]

This has been discussed at length over time. I believe there was a proposal for light rail around the back of the airport then travelling via Richmond Road to either greenhill road, or link in with the existing rail corridor at Keswic. There is also the option of utilising the old Glenelg train route from around Richmond with the tram leaving Richmond road where it crosses the old train reserve. The reserve is still largely intact as a park and bike track. ehichecer way, an airport light rail needs to be as direct and rapid as possible, with limited stops.

[ChillyPhilly]

This has been discussed at length over time. I believe there was a proposal for light rail around the back of the airport then travelling via Richmond Road to either greenhill road, or link in with the existing rail corridor at Keswic. There is also the option of utilising the old Glenelg train route from around Richmond with the tram leaving Richmond road where it crosses the old train reserve. The reserve is still largely intact as a park and bike track. ehichecer way, an airport light rail needs to be as direct and rapid as possible, with limited stops.

Light rail to the airport should utilise Henley Beach Road. I feel it could tie in with a little vision of mine for the commercial area east of the Marion Road intersection, as well as prove useful for the large contingent of elderly people that reside in the area.

[Waewick]

Question from the ignorant. Is there an express train from Gawler to Adelaide?

[Norman]

In peak hours there are trains that only stop at Gawler, Smithfield, Elizabeth, Salisbury and Mawson Lakes.