News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

[Verbatim9]

At least the new 25KV electrification is far superior of that in Sydney and Melbourne that run 15KV systems.

[PD2/20]

To think Melbourne electrified its rail network in 1904!

Not quite. Electric services started on most lines in 1919-1923. https://prov.vic.gov.au/about-us/our-bl ... rification

At least the new 25KV electrification is far superior of that in Sydney and Melbourne that run 15KV systems.

1500V DC.

[SBD]

Our pee wee train system is a mess. Should have been electrified decades ago and instead they go for retrofitting diesels and 2/3 of them are out of service. It then costs more money to fix them and they'll just fail again.

Then again the electrics have had their fare share of issues.

To think Melbourne electrified its rail network in 1904!

Not quite. Electric services started on most lines in 1919-1923. https://prov.vic.gov.au/about-us/our-bl ... rification

SA started talking about electrifying the trains around 1914, at the same time the trams were electrified.

[SRW]

To think Melbourne electrified its rail network in 1904!

Not quite. Electric services started on most lines in 1919-1923. https://prov.vic.gov.au/about-us/our-bl ... rification

SA started talking about electrifying the trains around 1914, at the same time the trams were electrified.

So roughly 100 years from idea to execution, given Seaford electrification completed in 2014. Going off that schedule, since we started talking about underground rail in the 1970s, we're probably 50 years away from actually getting it done

[SBD]

Not quite. Electric services started on most lines in 1919-1923. https://prov.vic.gov.au/about-us/our-bl ... rification

SA started talking about electrifying the trains around 1914, at the same time the trams were electrified.

So roughly 100 years from idea to execution, given Seaford electrification completed in 2014. Going off that schedule, since we started talking about underground rail in the 1970s, we're probably 50 years away from actually getting it done

It was apparently proposed to the Royal Commission on Transport in 1949, as part of the railways electrification scheme.
"Underground" The Mail (Adelaide, SA) 13 August 1949: p.42.

[claybro]

At least the new 25KV electrification is far superior of that in Sydney and Melbourne that run 15KV systems.

Which counts for little, when the trains are run at half their design speed.

[PD2/20]

At least the new 25KV electrification is far superior of that in Sydney and Melbourne that run 15KV systems.

Which counts for little, when the trains are run at half their design speed.

The rolling stock design speed is not the only factor that determines the operating speed of trains. Signalling, braking distances and track restrictions also determine safe operating speeds. Railway systems such as the AdMet network which have evolved over 150 years are more subject to such speed restrictions than systems that have been recently constructed to modern design standards.

[Waewick]

Marshall's advantage is the handling of the COVID pandemic. People will remember that for years to come.

Such as refusing to offer any assistance to government enterprise workers out of work due to COVID 19 but ineligible for JobKeeper.

Yep, I'm sure people will remember things like this.

Why do you think they are they better than everyone else who had to line up at centrelink.

[rubberman]

At least the new 25KV electrification is far superior of that in Sydney and Melbourne that run 15KV systems.

Which counts for little, when the trains are run at half their design speed.

The rolling stock design speed is not the only factor that determines the operating speed of trains. Signalling, braking distances and track restrictions also determine safe operating speeds. Railway systems such as the AdMet network which have evolved over 150 years are more subject to such speed restrictions than systems that have been recently constructed to modern design standards.

Well, yes, but none of that is relevant to the traction voltage, which was claybro's point.

In fact, if these other factors are immutable, is it even worth electrification?

I'm not trying to be snarky here. Rather, if electrification alone won't improve schedule speeds, the logical next step is either not to bother with electrification, OR ensure that eliminating the issues you mention must go hand in hand with electrification and be included in the whole project cost. However, spending all that money on electrification without an improvement in schedules is simply unacceptable.

[Norman]

I think the Gawler Line will see many of the benefits electrification can bring since the stations are a bit more spread out and the track is straighter.

There are parts on the Seaford line that are rated at 110km/h, including near Oaklands and the extension beyond Noarlunga.

[claybro]

I think the Gawler Line will see many of the benefits electrification can bring since the stations are a bit more spread out and the track is straighter.

There are parts on the Seaford line that are rated at 110km/h, including near Oaklands and the extension beyond Noarlunga.

Agree re the Gawler line Norman, but this is surely an argument for amalgamation of stations on other lines. Not much point as Rubberman points out of spending billions on nation leading power, and great rolling stock if it is not going to be used to advantage. As for Seaford, it's a while since I have ridden that line, but even after electrification, I don't believe the train I was on achieved anywhere near 110km/h... maybe 90 at most, but maybe it's improved?

[Goodsy]

I think the Gawler Line will see many of the benefits electrification can bring since the stations are a bit more spread out and the track is straighter.

There are parts on the Seaford line that are rated at 110km/h, including near Oaklands and the extension beyond Noarlunga.

The Gawler eletrification should also come with some modest line upgrades like crossing loops and station removals. We should be aiming for 160kph for an express line

Remove Greenfields, Parafield Gardens, Chidda, Nurlutta, Elizabeth South

New station at the A20 overpass to replace Tambelin and Evanston stations

Remove Kudla and replace it with a new station at Gordon Rd

Crossing loops where needed

[A-Town]

I think the Gawler Line will see many of the benefits electrification can bring since the stations are a bit more spread out and the track is straighter.

There are parts on the Seaford line that are rated at 110km/h, including near Oaklands and the extension beyond Noarlunga.

The Gawler eletrification should also come with some modest line upgrades like crossing loops and station removals. We should be aiming for 160kph for an express line

Remove Greenfields, Parafield Gardens, Chidda, Nurlutta, Elizabeth South

New station at the A20 overpass to replace Tambelin and Evanston stations

Remove Kudla and replace it with a new station at Gordon Rd

Crossing loops where needed

Agreed. The locations of some of these stations is bizarre to say the least.

[Norman]

I think the Gawler Line will see many of the benefits electrification can bring since the stations are a bit more spread out and the track is straighter.

There are parts on the Seaford line that are rated at 110km/h, including near Oaklands and the extension beyond Noarlunga.

The Gawler eletrification should also come with some modest line upgrades like crossing loops and station removals. We should be aiming for 160kph for an express line

Remove Greenfields, Parafield Gardens, Chidda, Nurlutta, Elizabeth South

New station at the A20 overpass to replace Tambelin and Evanston stations

Remove Kudla and replace it with a new station at Gordon Rd

Crossing loops where needed

At this point in time, 160km/h is excessive for a city the size of Adelaide. The extra costs for track maintenance and rolling stock wouldn't stack up the benefits for the 5 or 6 express trains that run in each direction. If those centres of Salisbury, Elizabeth and so on become more dense then it might be a point of discussion.

Just on people discussing removing stations, where else had this occurred in Australia on a large scale? I know people keep talking about those two new train lines in Perth, but even in Perth their legacy train lines still have the same amount of stations they had 50, 60 years ago. Apart from outliers like Greenfields, Marino Rocks and Kudla I just don't see the point. All those other stations like Parafield Gardens and Elizabeth South serve communities that rely on the rail network. If you want to speed up some services there are other methods like express services. But don't remove stations just because it looks good on a map or a timetable.

[PeFe]

I am one of those people who favour closing stations, here is my list :

Gawler Line

Close North Adelaide as a train station (but keep and protect the heritage building)
Remove : Greenfields, Nurlutta, Womma, Kudla, Tamblin, and Gawler Oval.
A new station can be built between Muno Parra and Gawler if the land is developed in the future.

Outer Harbor

Remove : Woodville Park, Ethelton, Peterhead, Largs North, Midlunga.
Rebuild a new Glanville station just south of the current site.

Belair Line

Remove : Mile End, Torrens Park, Lynton, Coromandel.
Build new station near Springbank Road replacing Torrens Park and Lynton

Seaford Line

Remove : Emerson, Hove, Warradale (with a new station in between) and Marino Rocks.

Some of Adelaide stations are truly embarrassing...why does anyone think that a station like Torrens Park attracts people to public transport?
People want safety and basic comfort as they wait for the train. Sadly few Adelaide train stations qualify...