News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

[[Shuz]]

Unfortunately I believe Grange in its current state is more likely to be earmarked for closure than electrification. There is not enough patronage to justify a train service.

Rerouting to West Lakes is not viable as the is no safe corridor available for trains.

The only feasible option to save Grange from being closed is to redirect the rail line to Henley Beach via the land corridor that runs parallel to Wright Street, with two new stops for Grange and Henley Beach. Henley Beach is a far more popular destination than Grange, with a higher population density, which in turn would increase patronage making the rail line more viable.

[MT269]

On another note, would it be practical to extend the roughly 100 metre crossing loop just south of Goodwood to the vicinity of Unley Park station?

The reason why the timetable for the Belair line is a mess is because of poor planning, and subsequent poor planning. The loops were built at locations which provided just enough time for trains to cross, and get to Goodwood in time for the next train to pass, with 1 minute of slack, as shown in the timetables from around the turn of the century. Since the reopening of Millswood, plus the loosening of most PT timetables by the DIT, this is impossible to do today.

If the dual track was extended to Unley Park, this would provide much needed headroom, should there be any delays.

All that would need to be done would be to widen the Goodwood Rd overpass, as well as widen the signal gantries. This would probably necessitate correspondence from ARTC, and the various operators. But it shouldn't be a major issue. However, it would require many $, as well as weakening any justifications to close the line completely.

[PD2/20]

When is the Ovingham project earmarked for completion?

The station rebuild (as part of the network station upgrade program) is due for completion in late 2022.

The level crossing removal project has timelines on the PTP Alliance website. The rail related components ie the removal of the level crossing and the construction of the gated pedestrian crossings have been completed although the gated crossings await activation. The rest of the project is the completion of the bridge roadways and and rearrangement of the local street network which is currently under way and the landscaping of the bridge precinct.
The crossing project has its own thread on the forum viewtopic.php?t=6948.

[Norman]

Unfortunately I believe Grange in its current state is more likely to be earmarked for closure than electrification. There is not enough patronage to justify a train service.

Rerouting to West Lakes is not viable as the is no safe corridor available for trains.

The only feasible option to save Grange from being closed is to redirect the rail line to Henley Beach via the land corridor that runs parallel to Wright Street, with two new stops for Grange and Henley Beach. Henley Beach is a far more popular destination than Grange, with a higher population density, which in turn would increase patronage making the rail line more viable.

I personally would like to see a single track elevated line to West Lakes, similar to what is at Flinders right now but elevated for the entire length. Add another stop near Frederick Road and you'll serve the eastern portion of the West development as well.

[MT269]

I had another look in regards to a line to WL. Houses along S Parade could be compulsorily acquired. The old SAHT houses east of Frederick Rd could be demolished to make way for chicane-like curves to access Brebner Dr, which could be repurposed as a rail corridor. From there, it's not that difficult. As an alternative, it could be built along the north end of the golf course.

Other houses which run parallel to the Blvd east of Tapleys Hill Rd could be acquired to make way for the corridor if necessary. Alternatively, the road could be narrowed with a railway built alongside it. There needs to be room for two tracks, not just one, despite it being likely that only one would be needed. An elevated line would be unjustifiable.

[Eurostar]

I had another look in regards to a line to WL. Houses along S Parade could be compulsorily acquired. The old SAHT houses east of Frederick Rd could be demolished to make way for chicane-like curves to access Brebner Dr, which could be repurposed as a rail corridor. From there, it's not that difficult. As an alternative, it could be built along the north end of the golf course.

Other houses which run parallel to the Blvd east of Tapleys Hill Rd could be acquired to make way for the corridor if necessary. Alternatively, the road could be narrowed with a railway built alongside it. There needs to be room for two tracks, not just one, despite it being likely that only one would be needed. An elevated line would be unjustifiable.

Or have bus lanes on Port Road and West Lakes Boulevard

[MT269]

No point having bus lanes when the timetables are so loose. Ironically, being stuck in traffic actually reduces early running. Many drivers tend to leave termini late, and deliberately try for red lights etc just to avoid running early.

Many don't even use the bus lane on Port Rd by Park Tce when heading inbound towards the city, due to the normal lane being a way to take out an extra minute or so.

Even the train/tram timetables have too much time in my opinion. It's like they're designed to be as slow as possible to fend off any extra patrons, and for every stop to be served. With no ticket sales, several minutes could be removed.

[EBG]

You all seem to be forgetting that the Grange line originally extended to Henley Beach, but was cut back to save time and money. An example of poor planning .

[claybro]

You all seem to be forgetting that the Grange line originally extended to Henley Beach, but was cut back to save time and money. An example of poor planning .

I don't think we want to go back to the days of diesel heavy railcars trundling along suburban roads. Positively dangerous, slow and noisy. Any attempt to extend heavy rail in this area would surely fail due to local residents and probably rightly so. If OH is electrified as heavy rail..its good bye Grange, which is a shame for Seaton and Woodville West/Albert Park residents. Once again Adelaide will have a major shopping center, not within walking distance of the nearest station.

[gnrc_louis]

You all seem to be forgetting that the Grange line originally extended to Henley Beach, but was cut back to save time and money. An example of poor planning .

I don't think we want to go back to the days of diesel heavy railcars trundling along suburban roads. Positively dangerous, slow and noisy. Any attempt to extend heavy rail in this area would surely fail due to local residents and probably rightly so. If OH is electrified as heavy rail..its good bye Grange, which is a shame for Seaton and Woodville West/Albert Park residents. Once again Adelaide will have a major shopping center, not within walking distance of the nearest station.

AND the Grange residents/plus the surrounding suburbs who park at the always full Grange park and ride.

[gnrc_louis]

Can someone post this please: https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/subscrib ... our=append

[Cryptic]

Building an Adelaide underground rail loop would benefit CBD and beyond | Michael McGuire
It would be eye-wateringly expensive – but there’s a clear way to benefit CBD and beyond. And it would be cheaper than the South Rd tunnels, writes Michael McGuire.

Michael McGuire
September 6, 2022 - 5:30AM


The Advertiser’s landmark Housing Forum on August 31 addressed the rental crisis and discussed how Adelaide's vacant office towers could be a key to solving the housing squeeze.
The impact of Covid has left many questions. One of them is how will the CBD look in the future?

The pandemic emptied the city, devastated many businesses and drove many workers back home, some never to return.

There is a feeling that, and not just in Adelaide, CBDs are going to have to adapt, to change, if they want to remain vital and dynamic hearts of their communities.

One of the ideas floated by last week’s housing forum, hosted by The Advertiser, was the need to vastly increase the permanent population of the CBD. Treasurer Stephen Mullighan suggested some older office buildings could be converted into housing.

But we also need to make it easier for people to live in the city.

There is an idea that is hidden in the state’s 20-year infrastructure program that was released by the Marshall government in May 2020 that could help with that. Not that it was even a new idea then. It was also part of the much lamented Metropolitan Adelaide Transport Study – the MATS plan – which was released all the way back in 1968.

The MATS plan proposed all sorts of freeways, expressways and bridges be built. It also suggested building a rail loop under the CBD.

It was an idea picked up by the 20-year infrastructure strategy.

“In the long term, the terminus nature of the Adelaide Railway Station will need to be reviewed with the potential to create a CBD rail loop,’’ the study says.

There is no doubt building a rail loop under the city will be expensive. A rough estimate is that it could cost between $6bn and $10bn.

That’s less than the expected cost of the last stage of the Torrens-to-Darlington project, which is budgeted at $10bn and will likely cost much more.

If the Malinauskas government was feeling particularly brave, it could can the hyper-expensive tunnels project on South Rd and switch the money into the CBD rail loop. There is every chance the state will receive a far higher economic benefit from the rail project.

It would also help clear some congestion from South Rd, as people swap car travel for a quicker, cheaper and easier ride into town.

A new rail loop in the city would have multiple benefits, not just for the CBD but Adelaide as a whole.

Currently, the capacity at the main Adelaide Railway Station is limited because it’s a terminus. Trains stop there and go back out. This constrains how many trains it can operate at peak hour. There are a limited number of platforms (a new train can’t come into the station until the old one leaves) and the services are already often overcrowded.

“Some services are currently running to capacity and additional carriages could be added; however, the length of many platforms does not allow for more than three carriages across the whole network,’’ the strategy document says.

A loop under the CBD would have the capacity to increase the numbers of trains delivering passengers to the city. Trains would no longer end at the Adelaide Railway Station.

You could run services from Gawler to Seaford, from Outer Harbor to Flinders, which would stop in the city and keep going.

It would also mean you could put an end to the Keswick Terminal and bring iconic trains such as The Ghan and the Indian Pacific into the heart of the city. That would be a win for tourism.

The underground CBD route is up for debate. But one possibility is to run it under King William St and up to Victoria Square, maybe with a branch to Hindmarsh Square, then through to the south of the city then out to Mile End to reconnect with the rail network.

There could be a stop in Victoria Square and one at City South. A stop in the south of the CBD would undoubtedly bring in more residents, encourage investment and create more jobs and services in that part of the CBD.

Adelaide’s CBD, bounded as it by the terraces, is an enormous area, but much of it feels unloved and forgotten. Investing in a rail loop would revitalise great parts of the city.

Other cities are making massive investments in CBD rail infrastructure. Sydney is investing heavily in its rail system, including new lines and stations under its CBD. Melbourne’s Metro Tunnel project is building five new underground stations, with the aim of running more trains more often across the city.

These are eye-wateringly pricey projects. Melbourne’s Metro project will cost more than $12bn.

But the benefits are there as well. The Adelaide Railway Station is removed from the main action of the CBD. But if Adelaide is to be regarded as a modern, well-planned city then improving public transport is imperative.

South Australia can’t grow its population, bring people into the city, attract business to the city if it is still stuck with a transport system that is stuck in another century.

[AG]

Building a new rail tunnel under King William Street would just be duplicating the existing tram lines with no real additional reach into the city not already provided. Running it to Hindmarsh Square and under Grote Street at least potentially opens up a few new parts of the city centre.

[Nathan]

Building a new rail tunnel under King William Street would just be duplicating the existing tram lines with no real additional reach into the city not already provided. Running it to Hindmarsh Square and under Grote Street at least potentially opens up a few new parts of the city centre.

And it's not like it would have any stops that the Hindmarsh Sq loop wouldn't. Plus it would require a much tighter turn immediately out of ARS, and trains aren't friends with tight 90° turns.

[MT269]

There is roughly a 250 metre gap between ARS and KW St. There are no benefits from having it go under this street in the very centre, compared to having it 50 metres to the right. Despite the lack of any foresight, trains can make this turn with ease.

It might be ideal to ensure that the trains can turn right as well! Raising the height of the KW/North Tce intersection could be a solution to the current debacle, which seems like it was just a cheap excuse to derail Labor's plan of a tram network.

It still makes no sense as to why they can turn left, but not right.