News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

[rev]

That felt like a political attack ad, far enough out from the general election that they don't want to propose solutions in case the current government has time to implement them.

I couldn't work out why the "small business" in the example was removing her stock from the fridge before turning it off. Did she over-produce and the excess is being chucked out, or is she letting stuff warm up that will be cooled again tomorrow when she turns her fridge back on? Electricity prices seemed to being blamed as a proxy for poor stock management or demand forecasting. Perhaps she should make less, and accept that some days she can knock off early because she sold out of the day's stock.

Channel 7 is generally pro Labour

South Australia has the highest energy prices is a fact.

Source??

As you have said not including it is not good etiquette and may not be meeting your legal obligations- Chanel 7 not included.

Most of the mainstream media on free to air generally has a left/Labor leaning tone. The only real right wing/Liberal-Nationals news source we have is generally Sky News if you're paying for Foxtel or whatever other services they stream on. But regardless of their political lean, if something presented by them is factual, that's all that should matter right?

[abc]

The majority of residential customers could see price reductions of between 0.4 per cent to 7.1 per cent, it added.

lol

[rubberman]

Channel 7 is generally pro Labour

South Australia has the highest energy prices is a fact.

Source??

As you have said not including it is not good etiquette and may not be meeting your legal obligations- Chanel 7 not included.

Most of the mainstream media on free to air generally has a left/Labor leaning tone. The only real right wing/Liberal-Nationals news source we have is generally Sky News if you're paying for Foxtel or whatever other services they stream on. But regardless of their political lean, if something presented by them is factual, that's all that should matter right?

Lolol.

[PeFe]

SA power bills set to drop.....should be a bigger drop considering the average wholesale price in SA (3.7 cents per kwh in the December quarter)

From Indaily

SA power bills set to drop after energy regulator decision

Average South Australian households and businesses will pay lower electricity bills from July 1 under a draft ruling from the national energy regulator.


SA average power bills are set to drop from July after a draft ruling from the Australian Energy Regulator. Photo: AAP

The Australian Energy Regulator on Tuesday released its draft Default Market Offer (DMO), known as DMO 6, for energy prices in 2024/25.

The default market offer, which will apply to consumers in South Australia, NSW and parts of Queensland, is a price cap on how much retailers can charge customers on their default plans.

“At this time, it is estimated that price changes for all residential and small business customers on standard retail plans will be less than the rate of inflation,” the regulator said on Tuesday.

The majority of residential customers could see price reductions of between 0.4 per cent to 7.1 per cent, it added.

The remaining residential customers may see increases between 0.9 per cent and 2.7 per cent, depending on their region and whether they have controlled load.

Most small business customers could see reductions between 0.3 per cent and 9.7 per cent while others could face modest increases of around 0.7 per cent, depending on their region.

“We know that economic conditions have put pressure on many Australians and the increases in electricity prices over the last two years has made energy less affordable for many households,” AER chair Clare Savage said in a statement.

“In light of this, the AER has, in this decision, placed increased weight on protecting consumers.”

South Australian Energy Minister Tom Koutsantonis said today’s decision would see power prices in this state drop by an average 2.5 per cent or $57 for households, and 8.2 per cent or $481 for small business.

The state government said that increasing renewable energy generation had cut wholesale electricity costs, which were the main factor in the AER’s draft decision to cut prices.

It said that “poles-and-wires network charges” in retail bills will increase by less than expected because of a change in accounting classification for some work performed by distributor SA Power Networks. The charges will include sharing the cost of repairs following the River Murray floods and transmission upgrades.

Koutsantonis said that households and businesses had been under inflation and cost of living pressure and the price cuts “show energy prices are going in the right direction”.

“We’ve been saying for months we expect to see reductions in wholesale costs reflected in the retail prices handed down by the Australian Energy Regulator, and that is exactly what has happened,” he said.

“The regulator’s reasons for these cuts verify what we have been saying for the past two years – the global gas price shock from Russia’s invasion of Ukraine caused high power prices here.”

Koutsantonis said the state government was “making SA more resilient against such shocks” by developing its Hydrogen Jobs Plan and supporting new renewable generators and batteries, with ZEN Energy today announcing construction of a 111-Megawatt battery at Templers in the Mid North.

https://www.indaily.com.au/business/ene ... r-decision

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

[abc]

That felt like a political attack ad, far enough out from the general election that they don't want to propose solutions in case the current government has time to implement them.

I couldn't work out why the "small business" in the example was removing her stock from the fridge before turning it off. Did she over-produce and the excess is being chucked out, or is she letting stuff warm up that will be cooled again tomorrow when she turns her fridge back on? Electricity prices seemed to being blamed as a proxy for poor stock management or demand forecasting. Perhaps she should make less, and accept that some days she can knock off early because she sold out of the day's stock.

Channel 7 is generally pro Labour

South Australia has the highest energy prices is a fact.

Source??

As you have said not including it is not good etiquette and may not be meeting your legal obligations- Chanel 7 not included.

The source is Channel 7. I posted the link.
Regardless, I can post facts without attributing to any source. Its not like I'm copying and pasting a press release and passing it off as my own work.

[abc]

SA power bills set to drop.....should be a bigger drop considering the average wholesale price in SA (3.7 cents per kwh in the December quarter)

From Indaily

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

The majority of residential customers could see price reductions of between 0.4 per cent to 7.1 per cent, it added.

The remaining residential customers may see increases between 0.9 per cent and 2.7 per cent, depending on their region and whether they have controlled load.

Most small business customers could see reductions between 0.3 per cent and 9.7 per cent while others could face modest increases of around 0.7 per cent, depending on their region.

[rev]

SA power bills set to drop.....should be a bigger drop considering the average wholesale price in SA (3.7 cents per kwh in the December quarter)

From Indaily

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

Lets be honest, I'm not saying anything controversial or complicated. There's no political spin, no Labor or Liberal slant. Pretty straight forward.
We are promised prices will come down. X or Y reason are given.
Prices go up. We are given excuse A or B.

How many times are we going to be told that this or that will bring down prices, only for the opposite to happen and prices go up, before you acknowledge that something isn't right instead of making excuses?
All these efforts, all this money, being put in to renewables, to bring down prices, and prices keep going up.
But we aren't allowed to question what's going on, why our costs keep rising, and we definitely can't question the ridiculous excuses rolled out.


I guess you're not going to take the bet? Is that because you too have little faith that prices will come down?

[PeFe]

Another large battery for SA

From Indaily

Adelaide company unveils plans for another big battery

A South Australia-based energy company will build the state’s second-largest energy storage project 60km north of Adelaide to boost electricity supply reliability.

ZEN Energy today announced its battery storage project at Templers, 14.5km north of Gawler.

The 111-Megawatt battery will be operational in 2025 according to ZEN, which was founded in 2004 by Richard Turner who stepped away from managing the business in 2019.

The company hopes the project will boost the reliability of electricity supply as South Australia moves towards being 100 per cent powered by renewable energy by 2027.

It will be ZEN’s first battery project, with the company previously building renewable energy infrastructure with solar and wind farms.

The energy storage project will be owned entirely by ZEN, which will enter into a 100 per cent tolling offtake agreement with companies that supply the battery with energy.

ZEN expects 180 local jobs to be created during construction. The firm said the project was “enabled through the South Australian Government’s commitment to a long-term energy contract with the company”.

Investment partners on the project include alternative investment firm Stonepeak and French bank Natixis.

Superannuation fund Future Super also invested $30 million in ZEN’s corporate note with the capital “integral to projects like the Templers battery and enable ZEN to retain 100 per cent ownership of the asset”.

ElectraNet – the owner of South Australia’s high voltage transmission network – will build and maintain a dedicated connection to the battery according to ZEN.

CEO Anthony Garnaut said reaching the final investment decision for the Templers battery was “a key milestone in ZEN’s significant growth path and marks our first 100 per cent owned major asset, in the state where we started”.

“The South Australian Government, through committing to a long-term contract with a renewable retailer has enabled this significant investment in further stabilising the supply of renewable, affordable energy into South Australia,” Garnaut said.

“Commitment and support from our capital partners including Stonepeak, Peak Energy, Natixis Bank, Future Super and other leading institutions including Longreach, IAM and Azure Capital enable ZEN to continue to bring more renewable assets to the grid in South Australia.”

Energy and Mining Minister Tom Koutsantonis welcomed the news.

“South Australia led the pack when we invested in the Hornsdale Power Reserve, and our state is now home to six grid-connected batteries with a total capacity of more than 500MW,” he said.

“These investments are a big vote of confidence in our state’s ambitious plan to get to net zero emissions in energy production by 2027, and to help the world along the pathway to decarbonisation.

“Like South Australia, ZEN was an early mover in the renewable energy space. It’s great to see a home-grown success story joining us in the journey to a decarbonised economy.”

ZEN’s battery will be smaller than AGL Energy’s Torrens Island power station energy storage system, which was unveiled in August last year and covers an area the size of Adelaide Oval.

AGL’s system can provide enough electricity to power 75,000 homes for one hour, with the option to extend the duration to four hours with a future expansion.

In June 2023, a $22 million vanadium flow battery and co-located solar farm was unveiled at Port Pirie by Yadlamalka Energy.

https://www.indaily.com.au/business/ene ... ig-battery

[rubberman]

SA power bills set to drop.....should be a bigger drop considering the average wholesale price in SA (3.7 cents per kwh in the December quarter)

From Indaily

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

There's no hope of communicating. They aren't prepared to argue in good faith. However, it is important to make sure that absurd assertions are refuted so that the unwary reader isn't conned.

[rev]

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

There's no hope of communicating. They aren't prepared to argue in good faith. However, it is important to make sure that absurd assertions are refuted so that the unwary reader isn't conned.

See here's the issue, you seem to think there needs to be an argument here? I'm merely asking some questions, and wondering why the opposite is happening continually to what we're being told will happen with this venture or that venture which are all supposedly as we're told, meant to bring down our power costs.
Is what the regulator said recently in pefes post going to actually bring down costs? is that new battery? Why should we believe that that will be the case THIS TIME?
Pretty fucking fair question I'd say. But hey, I'm not driven by political ideologies like some.

If you want to post ideological spin, then go for it. Don't cry about it when others don't swallow it like you have.

But remember, it was you who had a dig at me with your "grade 3 maths" remarks. Or you suggesting that everyone should already have solar & battery and if they don't it's their own fault, which is a completely insensitive and pig headed thing to say. I'm sure not everyone that posts on this forum is able to afford those things, let alone the general public the majority of whom it is well established live week to week and have stuff all savings in their bank accounts.

If you haven't cottoned on yet, I'm not against renewables. I actually think every house should have solar & battery setups, and that the government should pay the bulk of it instead of wasting our money on large scale projects that they promise to bring down our power prices but for some reasons (which neither you nor pefe can answer without ideological excuses) seem to keep going up.
I'm against being bullshitted to by elected officials and being taken for a ride. I thought that was a pretty common theme amongst the average person in society, but apparently you and pefe prefer to be bullshitted to and taken for a ride by politcians. You do you.Enjoy your posts.

[abc]

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

There's no hope of communicating. They aren't prepared to argue in good faith. However, it is important to make sure that absurd assertions are refuted so that the unwary reader isn't conned.

This sounds like you're running propaganda. Maybe try communicating like a normal human instead of pushing an agenda.

[SBD]

More promises.

Should we take bets(non financial) on whether power prices will drop because of this, or not like all the other broken promises?

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

The majority of residential customers could see price reductions of between 0.4 per cent to 7.1 per cent, it added.

The remaining residential customers may see increases between 0.9 per cent and 2.7 per cent, depending on their region and whether they have controlled load.

Most small business customers could see reductions between 0.3 per cent and 9.7 per cent while others could face modest increases of around 0.7 per cent, depending on their region.

"Could see" relates at least in part to the variation in consumption from one day/month/year to the next. If the price of each kWh goes down by 5% but the customer uses 10% more electricity, the bill will be higher, despite cheaper electricity.

It looks like just about every plan has a different daily supply charge. The retailer will be paying the same amount for transmission, distribution, metering etc, so these different supply charges are tweaked to make it harder to do a one-size-fits-all comparison of plans. Presumably it's to make a similar profit from high use (lower daily rate) and lower use/higher fixed rate customers.

[SBD]

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

There's no hope of communicating. They aren't prepared to argue in good faith. However, it is important to make sure that absurd assertions are refuted so that the unwary reader isn't conned.

See here's the issue, you seem to think there needs to be an argument here? I'm merely asking some questions, and wondering why the opposite is happening continually to what we're being told will happen with this venture or that venture which are all supposedly as we're told, meant to bring down our power costs.
Is what the regulator said recently in pefes post going to actually bring down costs? is that new battery? Why should we believe that that will be the case THIS TIME?
Pretty fucking fair question I'd say. But hey, I'm not driven by political ideologies like some.

If you want to post ideological spin, then go for it. Don't cry about it when others don't swallow it like you have.

But remember, it was you who had a dig at me with your "grade 3 maths" remarks. Or you suggesting that everyone should already have solar & battery and if they don't it's their own fault, which is a completely insensitive and pig headed thing to say. I'm sure not everyone that posts on this forum is able to afford those things, let alone the general public the majority of whom it is well established live week to week and have stuff all savings in their bank accounts.

If you haven't cottoned on yet, I'm not against renewables. I actually think every house should have solar & battery setups, and that the government should pay the bulk of it instead of wasting our money on large scale projects that they promise to bring down our power prices but for some reasons (which neither you nor pefe can answer without ideological excuses) seem to keep going up.
I'm against being bullshitted to by elected officials and being taken for a ride. I thought that was a pretty common theme amongst the average person in society, but apparently you and pefe prefer to be bullshitted to and taken for a ride by politcians. You do you.Enjoy your posts.

The lady I heard on ABC radio this morning said the Default Rate will be decreasing this round. She said slightly over 10% of customers are on the default contract. I got the impression that the reduction was caused by increased proportion of energy coming from renewable energy sources. She expected that other contracts will likely reduce in line with using the default rate as a reference point, but is not in a position to guarantee that.

In my understanding, grid-scale batteries (and pumped hydro) are ways of time-shifting generation. Looking at NEM monitoring websites often show an excess or curtailment of generation while the sun is shining and the wind is blowing, but a deficit that needs to be imported or generated from more expensive sources at other times - particularly evening meal and sunset time.

Whether we like it or not, we have a National Electricity market, which means it is market and economic forces that push companies to build or retire generators. Politicians can attempt to perturb the market with varying degrees of effectiveness, but the significant and lasting changes take time to have an effect.

As smart meters have been rolled out, retailers are able to charge different rates for consumption at different times, which means they don't have to average the sale price to cover unanticipated spikes in their cost prices. This will slowly change customers behaviour too, such as running the dishwasher/clothes dryer at cheaper times.

[SBD]

Two websites I discovered today from listening to the discussions about electricity:

• https://www.energymadeeasy.gov.au/ - a free government service to compare available electricity plans. You can enter your meter NMI and if enough data is available it will use your actual historic pattern. This wasn't available to me as my current (smart) meter hasn't been installed long enough.
• https://customer.portal.sapowernetworks.com.au/ can connect to your smart meter and show actual usage in near real time
• My retailer also has a phone app that seems to connect to the meter data

[rubberman]

Well if you bothered to read the posts, or do your own research you would know that energy prices in this country are overseen by the Australian Energy Regulator.

So when the Australian Energy Regulator says "we are the changing the default offer on electricity to a lower base" then a reasonable person would presume that the prices will come down.

You make so many posts on Sensational Adelaide but contribute so little...

Whingeing is no substitute for research/information.....

There's no hope of communicating. They aren't prepared to argue in good faith. However, it is important to make sure that absurd assertions are refuted so that the unwary reader isn't conned.

This sounds like you're running propaganda. Maybe try communicating like a normal human instead of pushing an agenda.

Lol. Apparently belief in the laws of supply and demand in a market is "pushing an agenda".

Closing the Port Augusta power stations reduced supply. The laws of supply and demand say pressure is on prices to go up.

Introduction of renewables increased supply. The laws of supply and demand say pressure is on prices to go down.

That's it. A fact of life in a market. But believe whatever you will. I just think you are pushing it up hill if you think that belief in market forces is "pushing an agenda".

I'll let others judge that.