SA Economy

[Waewick]

From the AGL final report for 2024. Net profit after tax UP 189%

But nah. Those pesky renewables.

Now, it's a 5% profit margin, so not unreasonable, but perhaps we could stop being simplistic here. In reality, the decision to privatise ETSA has led us to this point. SA, and its economy has been scrambling for power, any type of power since that happened. The closure of the Northern and Tom Playford power stations were out of our hands. The loss of control of Torrens Island and Osborne as well.

But apparently we must blame everyone but the decision to privatise.

I have to admit, I find it incredible a niche forum like this can attract two posters with such large opinions but such low understanding on the same topic.

Its almost like it's the same person posting under two accounts.

[rubberman]

From the AGL final report for 2024. Net profit after tax UP 189%

But nah. Those pesky renewables.

Now, it's a 5% profit margin, so not unreasonable, but perhaps we could stop being simplistic here. In reality, the decision to privatise ETSA has led us to this point. SA, and its economy has been scrambling for power, any type of power since that happened. The closure of the Northern and Tom Playford power stations were out of our hands. The loss of control of Torrens Island and Osborne as well.

But apparently we must blame everyone but the decision to privatise.

I have to admit, I find it incredible a niche forum like this can attract two posters with such large opinions but such low understanding on the same topic.

Its almost like it's the same person posting under two accounts.

So. If under privatisation, the private companies close every single major power station in the State, what do you think the outcome is going to be?

You seem to claim higher understanding.

I'm happy to hear whatever theory this higher understanding brings to the question of why power prices are high.

[Waewick]

From the AGL final report for 2024. Net profit after tax UP 189%

But nah. Those pesky renewables.

Now, it's a 5% profit margin, so not unreasonable, but perhaps we could stop being simplistic here. In reality, the decision to privatise ETSA has led us to this point. SA, and its economy has been scrambling for power, any type of power since that happened. The closure of the Northern and Tom Playford power stations were out of our hands. The loss of control of Torrens Island and Osborne as well.

But apparently we must blame everyone but the decision to privatise.

I have to admit, I find it incredible a niche forum like this can attract two posters with such large opinions but such low understanding on the same topic.

Its almost like it's the same person posting under two accounts.

So. If under privatisation, the private companies close every single major power station in the State, what do you think the outcome is going to be?

You seem to claim higher understanding.

I'm happy to hear whatever theory this higher understanding brings to the question of why power prices are high.

Oh, sorry, I was not referring to you

[rubberman]

I have to admit, I find it incredible a niche forum like this can attract two posters with such large opinions but such low understanding on the same topic.

Its almost like it's the same person posting under two accounts.

So. If under privatisation, the private companies close every single major power station in the State, what do you think the outcome is going to be?

You seem to claim higher understanding.

I'm happy to hear whatever theory this higher understanding brings to the question of why power prices are high.

Oh, sorry, I was not referring to you

Whew.

[Jaymz]

I'm the furthest from being an expert on the topic so correct me if I'm wrong.

The privatisation of ETSA, now S.A Power Networks (SAPN) was the sale of transmission infrastructure such as poles and wires, substations, transformers and the likes. It is shown on our bills as the "daily supply charge". It had nothing to do with the generation of electricity or retail sectors of the whole cycle.

That is unless the Northern Power station was included in the sale and sold off afterwards. That is a possibility I guess.

Anyways, on my last bill my daily supply charge had increased about 5% from the corresponding period last year. The cost of electricity however was up around 17%.

[Waewick]

Just on the economy, does anyone know where we can see population numbers ?

Traffic feels like it has got significantly worse, can't just be bad PT

[rubberman]

I'm the furthest from being an expert on the topic so correct me if I'm wrong.

The privatisation of ETSA, now S.A Power Networks (SAPN) was the sale of transmission infrastructure such as poles and wires, substations, transformers and the likes. It is shown on our bills as the "daily supply charge". It had nothing to do with the generation of electricity or retail sectors of the whole cycle.

That is unless the Northern Power station was included in the sale and sold off afterwards. That is a possibility I guess.

Anyways, on my last bill my daily supply charge had increased about 5% from the corresponding period last year. The cost of electricity however was up around 17%.

The sale of ETSA included the sale of its retail arm. That means retailers buy electricity from generators, pay for transmission, then add their own profit and sell to customers.

It also included the sale of the generators. So, the stations at Port Augusta and Torrens Island became private.

The poles and wires, SA Power Networks, are government owned, but privately operated. Their charges, are incorporated in the bills sent out by retailers.

So, when your bill goes up, it could be because the retailer wants a bigger profit. Or, it could be because the generators want a bigger profit (including renewable generators). Or it could be that SA Power Networks has to give their owners a bigger dividend (or put up more poles and wires).

So, whenever someone says charges are going up because of renewables, they are ignoring the possibility that retailers, fossil fuel generators, SA Power Networks etc are putting up prices.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electri ... 0in%201999.

What is annoying is that these facts are publicly available, yet anti-renewable people completely ignore them.

[abc]

Just on the economy, does anyone know where we can see population numbers ?

Traffic feels like it has got significantly worse, can't just be bad PT

when statistics become politically inconvenient they become harder to come by

in the UK for example they've been obfuscating the true population there for over a decade... its estimated to be somewhere near 80 million now but the official stats say its only around 60 million

the last ABS estimate for greater metro Adelaide, which somehow also includes Mt Barker was 1.418 million in 2022 and based on estimated growth rate of around 1% its about 1.442 million now

the traffic has gotten worse since the covid era as more people are out and about than they were for 3 years... more single person households due to social changes probably also puts more cars on the road

[Norman]

I'm not sure how population statistics are difficult to come by in Australia... The Bureau of Statistics has a population clock, which includes data from the past and estimates into the future. You can even go state by state.

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/peopl ... ck-pyramid

The current estimated population of SA is 1,886,661.

[Waewick]

I'm not sure how population statistics are difficult to come by in Australia... The Bureau of Statistics has a population clock, which includes data from the past and estimates into the future. You can even go state by state.

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/peopl ... ck-pyramid

The current estimated population of SA is 1,886,661.

I've never seen that one before.

So ~90k more people than 2020.

So probably not a traffic causing issue.

[rev]

Good to know one doesn't even know how to find statistics. Speaks volumes.

Local company spends a fortune on going "green", yet power bills go up. The circus arrives to tell us how this time its the privatization ETSA to blame.

[rev]

I'm the furthest from being an expert on the topic so correct me if I'm wrong.

The privatisation of ETSA, now S.A Power Networks (SAPN) was the sale of transmission infrastructure such as poles and wires, substations, transformers and the likes. It is shown on our bills as the "daily supply charge". It had nothing to do with the generation of electricity or retail sectors of the whole cycle.

That is unless the Northern Power station was included in the sale and sold off afterwards. That is a possibility I guess.

Anyways, on my last bill my daily supply charge had increased about 5% from the corresponding period last year. The cost of electricity however was up around 17%.

Did you install solar panels yet like the self proclaimed experts on the universe advised in one of the other threads?
If not, it's your own fault that your supply charge and cost of electricity went up..
And now apparently even if you did install solar panels, it's the ETSA privatization that's now to blame.

[Waewick]

Good to know one doesn't even know how to find statistics. Speaks volumes.

Local company spends a fortune on going "green", yet power bills go up. The circus arrives to tell us how this time its the privatization ETSA to blame.

I don't spend my time looking up population statistics.

Sort of how you don't spend much time understanding the basics of power bills and electricity generation.

More importantly, i don't embarrass myself pretending I do

[rev]

Here's another genius idea from our illustrious leaders who are ohh so in touch with the reality the majority of their constituents are living in...


Its ok everyone, companies are up against it, many going under, but our treasurer says "try and negotiate". That's great policy. Did he consult some from this forum for that one?
Their other solution is to throw tax payers money at something that clearly isn't working..So tax payers foot the bill for poor policy again. But we'll blame ETSA, maybe the state bank collapse. Maybe the collapse of the Soviet Union. Who knows what will be blamed tomorrow with this lot.

They've offered, I think the feds in fact, cost of living relief for power bills. Question, how many power retailers put their prices up simultaneously? You'd be surprised..

Are they at the very least ensuring it's locally produced hardware that's being paid for with our tax money? At least so our economy can see some benefit from this scheme.

SA business sector gets boost for cleaner energy change
The treasurer has called on big companies, such as Nippy’s, to negotiate their power contracts to avoid being stung while announcing grants for small businesses.

Tara Miko
@Tara_Miko
less than 2 min read
August 27, 2024 - 4:30PM

Larger energy consumers should negotiate better contracts and avoid the spot market in a warning to the state’s big business sector.

Treasurer Stephen Mullighan said large operators such as Nippy’s – whose power bills have surged from $51,600 last June to $109,580.10 – should “try and negotiate with the retailer” for better contracts, and avoid the volatile spot market.

Mr Mullighan, announcing grants of up to $50,000 for small businesses to invest to reduce their energy costs, said it was critical big businesses negotiate their contracts.

“When you’ve got large energy consumers in the South Australian economy … You do have a level of market power to be able to negotiate a contract with a retailer and try and bring down those prices that you’re charged by the retailers on an ongoing basis,” he said.

Nippy’s monthly electricity bill more than doubled in a year despite it investing in solar panels and using fewer power hours.

Electrolux Group has upgraded one furnace from gas to electricity, and invested heavily in solar panels about eight years ago that powers its day shifts.

Adelaide general manager Phillip Saloniklis said there had been minor power price rises for the plant.

Small Business Minister Andrea Michaels said the second round of grants under the $154m Economy Recovery Fund would help smaller operators invest in energy-saving systems.

Grants range from $2500 to $50,000, subject to a matching contribution from the applicant.

https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/subscrib ... nt-1-SCORE

FYI this is the roof of Electrolux Adelaide, who also had price rises.

[SouthAussie94]

Here's another genius idea from our illustrious leaders who are ohh so in touch with the reality the majority of their constituents are living in...


Its ok everyone, companies are up against it, many going under, but our treasurer says "try and negotiate". That's great policy. Did he consult some from this forum for that one?
Their other solution is to throw tax payers money at something that clearly isn't working..So tax payers foot the bill for poor policy again. But we'll blame ETSA, maybe the state bank collapse. Maybe the collapse of the Soviet Union. Who knows what will be blamed tomorrow with this lot.

They've offered, I think the feds in fact, cost of living relief for power bills. Question, how many power retailers put their prices up simultaneously? You'd be surprised..

Are they at the very least ensuring it's locally produced hardware that's being paid for with our tax money? At least so our economy can see some benefit from this scheme.

SA business sector gets boost for cleaner energy change
The treasurer has called on big companies, such as Nippy’s, to negotiate their power contracts to avoid being stung while announcing grants for small businesses.

Tara Miko
@Tara_Miko
less than 2 min read
August 27, 2024 - 4:30PM

Larger energy consumers should negotiate better contracts and avoid the spot market in a warning to the state’s big business sector.

Treasurer Stephen Mullighan said large operators such as Nippy’s – whose power bills have surged from $51,600 last June to $109,580.10 – should “try and negotiate with the retailer” for better contracts, and avoid the volatile spot market.

Mr Mullighan, announcing grants of up to $50,000 for small businesses to invest to reduce their energy costs, said it was critical big businesses negotiate their contracts.

“When you’ve got large energy consumers in the South Australian economy … You do have a level of market power to be able to negotiate a contract with a retailer and try and bring down those prices that you’re charged by the retailers on an ongoing basis,” he said.

Nippy’s monthly electricity bill more than doubled in a year despite it investing in solar panels and using fewer power hours.

Electrolux Group has upgraded one furnace from gas to electricity, and invested heavily in solar panels about eight years ago that powers its day shifts.

Adelaide general manager Phillip Saloniklis said there had been minor power price rises for the plant.

Small Business Minister Andrea Michaels said the second round of grants under the $154m Economy Recovery Fund would help smaller operators invest in energy-saving systems.

Grants range from $2500 to $50,000, subject to a matching contribution from the applicant.

https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/subscrib ... nt-1-SCORE

FYI this is the roof of Electrolux Adelaide, who also had price rises.

If I need to buy 100,000 cans of tomatoes, I can either go to the shop and pay the retail price that people who buy 1 or 2 cans pay. Or I can go to the people who make cans of tomatoes and try to negotiate a better price.

Seems reasonable to me