News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

[abc]

If they extend it that far , does the frequency of the Trains to day Noarlunga get impacted negatively?

Or would they do express past Noarlunga ?

'cos there's sooo many people living at Sellicks...

[Spotto]

If they extend it that far , does the frequency of the Trains to day Noarlunga get impacted negatively?

Or would they do express past Noarlunga ?

'cos there's sooo many people living at Sellicks...

There weren’t that many people living at Seaford or Aldinga until they started building houses either.

Sensible to aim for a safeguarded corridor to Sellicks even if the railway will only go as far as Aldinga in the foreseeable future. Saves on the hassle and cost of pesky acquisitions when the time comes.

[PD2/20]

If they extend it that far , does the frequency of the Trains to day Noarlunga get impacted negatively?

Or would they do express past Noarlunga ?

The present Seaford timetable has 4 trains per hour off-peak stopping all stations Woodlands Park - Seaford and 4 tph stopping Adelaide - Woodlands Park (2 Seaford and 2 Flinders). So there appears to be enough patronage to justify these level of service. In peak hours Seaford has 9 tph with varied stopping patterns and Flinders 3 tph. Gawler has 4 tph off-peak with alternating skip stop patterns while Outer Harbor (fast - Woodville), Port Dock and Grange each are 2 tph. With an Aldinga extension, the existing off-peak stoppers may be extended to Aldinga or some semi-fast workings may be added. It would depend on the predicted patronage. A portion of the traffic to Seaford continues further by bus.

[ChillyPhilly]

If they extend it that far , does the frequency of the Trains to day Noarlunga get impacted negatively?

Or would they do express past Noarlunga ?

The present Seaford timetable has 4 trains per hour off-peak stopping all stations Woodlands Park - Seaford and 4 tph stopping Adelaide - Woodlands Park (2 Seaford and 2 Flinders). So there appears to be enough patronage to justify these level of service. In peak hours Seaford has 9 tph with varied stopping patterns and Flinders 3 tph. Gawler has 4 tph off-peak with alternating skip stop patterns while Outer Harbor (fast - Woodville), Port Dock and Grange each are 2 tph. With an Aldinga extension, the existing off-peak stoppers may be extended to Aldinga or some semi-fast workings may be added. It would depend on the predicted patronage. A portion of the traffic to Seaford continues further by bus.

I wonder if this can be improved with faster running, or running of 6-car sets in peak hour.

[Nort]

If they extend it that far , does the frequency of the Trains to day Noarlunga get impacted negatively?

Or would they do express past Noarlunga ?

'cos there's sooo many people living at Sellicks...

There weren’t that many people living at Seaford or Aldinga until they started building houses either.

Sensible to aim for a safeguarded corridor to Sellicks even if the railway will only go as far as Aldinga in the foreseeable future. Saves on the hassle and cost of pesky acquisitions when the time comes.

Yep, with the housing developments at Aldinga and the duplication of the road it's inevitable that a few decades from now everything west of South Road will look like Aldinga Beach does now. Makes sense to reserve the train line now.

[[Shuz]]

Aldinga Scrub Conservation Park is protected from development so that brown bit definitely won't be developed on. There's also some McLaren Vale Character Preservation planning overlays on a few farms down that way as well so it won't be as developed as you may expect it to be. Land releases down south are very much in a state of drip feed at the moment, compared to the northern suburbs.

Ironic that the planning priority seems to be for a train line down south where housing will be constrained as opposed to a new train line up north to service the mammoth Dry Creek and Riverlea housing estates.

Both are needed, but the priorities are wrong.

[Eurostar]

Aldinga Scrub Conservation Park is protected from development so that brown bit definitely won't be developed on. There's also some McLaren Vale Character Preservation planning overlays on a few farms down that way as well so it won't be as developed as you may expect it to be. Land releases down south are very much in a state of drip feed at the moment, compared to the northern suburbs.

Ironic that the planning priority seems to be for a train line down south where housing will be constrained as opposed to a new train line up north to service the mammoth Dry Creek and Riverlea housing estates.

Both are needed, but the priorities are wrong.

With the way Munno Para West, Andrews Farm and Angle Vale are growing a branch line from Elizabeth to Angle Vale would be wise.

[Spotto]

With the way Munno Para West, Andrews Farm and Angle Vale are growing a branch line from Elizabeth to Angle Vale would be wise.

Those suburbs would be well served by increased bus frequency as feeder services to the Gawler line. Smithfield Interchange is only a 10min bus ride away from Munno Para West and Andrews Farm.

If passenger services ever returned to Two Wells, a bus service running Angle Vale to Virginia (similar to the Angle Vale to Smithfield bus) would make that area pretty accessible if done correctly.

[rev]

With the way Munno Para West, Andrews Farm and Angle Vale are growing a branch line from Elizabeth to Angle Vale would be wise.

Those suburbs would be well served by increased bus frequency as feeder services to the Gawler line. Smithfield Interchange is only a 10min bus ride away from Munno Para West and Andrews Farm.

If passenger services ever returned to Two Wells, a bus service running Angle Vale to Virginia (similar to the Angle Vale to Smithfield bus) would make that area pretty accessible if done correctly.

If the expectation will be that people catch a bus, to then catch a train, it's not going to work. They'll just drive them selves.
Public transport needs to be convenient and simple.

[Spotto]

With the way Munno Para West, Andrews Farm and Angle Vale are growing a branch line from Elizabeth to Angle Vale would be wise.

Those suburbs would be well served by increased bus frequency as feeder services to the Gawler line. Smithfield Interchange is only a 10min bus ride away from Munno Para West and Andrews Farm.

If passenger services ever returned to Two Wells, a bus service running Angle Vale to Virginia (similar to the Angle Vale to Smithfield bus) would make that area pretty accessible if done correctly.

If the expectation will be that people catch a bus, to then catch a train, it's not going to work. They'll just drive them selves.
Public transport needs to be convenient and simple.

It’s true some people will have the option to drive to their nearest station, others will also value the use of a bus.

First mile/last mile is always the trickiest element of public transport. Using your car to drive to your nearest station or bus interchange seems to be a uniquely Australian situation. Carparks have limited capacity, if we can give people alternative and easy options (bus, cycle, walk, etc.) to get to their nearest station instead it only serves to benefit everyone.

Not everyone lives close enough to a rail line to make this possible. But for those that do, we should develop these options.

[rubberman]

Those suburbs would be well served by increased bus frequency as feeder services to the Gawler line. Smithfield Interchange is only a 10min bus ride away from Munno Para West and Andrews Farm.

If passenger services ever returned to Two Wells, a bus service running Angle Vale to Virginia (similar to the Angle Vale to Smithfield bus) would make that area pretty accessible if done correctly.

If the expectation will be that people catch a bus, to then catch a train, it's not going to work. They'll just drive them selves.
Public transport needs to be convenient and simple.

It’s true some people will have the option to drive to their nearest station, others will also value the use of a bus.

First mile/last mile is always the trickiest element of public transport. Using your car to drive to your nearest station or bus interchange seems to be a uniquely Australian situation. Carparks have limited capacity, if we can give people alternative and easy options (bus, cycle, walk, etc.) to get to their nearest station instead it only serves to benefit everyone.

Not everyone lives close enough to a rail line to make this possible. But for those that do, we should develop these options.

It's simply impractical and unrealistic to have rail everywhere. The only way it can work is with feeders of some type, be that bus or tram.

[dbl96]

If the expectation will be that people catch a bus, to then catch a train, it's not going to work. They'll just drive them selves.
Public transport needs to be convenient and simple.

It’s true some people will have the option to drive to their nearest station, others will also value the use of a bus.

First mile/last mile is always the trickiest element of public transport. Using your car to drive to your nearest station or bus interchange seems to be a uniquely Australian situation. Carparks have limited capacity, if we can give people alternative and easy options (bus, cycle, walk, etc.) to get to their nearest station instead it only serves to benefit everyone.

Not everyone lives close enough to a rail line to make this possible. But for those that do, we should develop these options.

It's simply impractical and unrealistic to have rail everywhere. The only way it can work is with feeders of some type, be that bus or tram.

True, but there is probably already a similar number of people living on that western corridor from Elizabeth to Angle Vale as there is on the corridor from Seaford to Aldinga - let alone Sellicks.

Not saying it should be a priority, but in the long term it might be worthy of investigation, as it is sufficiently distant from the Gawler line. It would be worth reserving a corridor now while land is available and cheap. If it never gets built, who cares - the community will have a nice linear park, like the old Glenelg rail alignment through the western suburbs.

As far as rail goes, there are certainly many greater priorities though. In my view, top of the list should be the northwest corridor to Riverlea and Two Wells. That is where the biggest area of greenfield as growth will be by far, and a rail extension there would be fairly simple to execute from an engineering perspective. Over the medium term, it likely offers the biggest bang for buck in terms of patronage for dollars spent, when compared with other candidates like Mount Barker or Sellicks Beach.

[abc]

Adelaide's metro expansion will mostly be into the northern plains (hellscape)

[dbl96]

Adelaide's metro expansion will mostly be into the northern plains (hellscape)

Precisely my point. Riverlea will be bigger than Gawler is today when it is completed.

[rubberman]

It’s true some people will have the option to drive to their nearest station, others will also value the use of a bus.

First mile/last mile is always the trickiest element of public transport. Using your car to drive to your nearest station or bus interchange seems to be a uniquely Australian situation. Carparks have limited capacity, if we can give people alternative and easy options (bus, cycle, walk, etc.) to get to their nearest station instead it only serves to benefit everyone.

Not everyone lives close enough to a rail line to make this possible. But for those that do, we should develop these options.

It's simply impractical and unrealistic to have rail everywhere. The only way it can work is with feeders of some type, be that bus or tram.

True, but there is probably already a similar number of people living on that western corridor from Elizabeth to Angle Vale as there is on the corridor from Seaford to Aldinga - let alone Sellicks.

Not saying it should be a priority, but in the long term it might be worthy of investigation, as it is sufficiently distant from the Gawler line. It would be worth reserving a corridor now while land is available and cheap. If it never gets built, who cares - the community will have a nice linear park, like the old Glenelg rail alignment through the western suburbs.

As far as rail goes, there are certainly many greater priorities though. In my view, top of the list should be the northwest corridor to Riverlea and Two Wells. That is where the biggest area of greenfield as growth will be by far, and a rail extension there would be fairly simple to execute from an engineering perspective. Over the medium term, it likely offers the biggest bang for buck in terms of patronage for dollars spent, when compared with other candidates like Mount Barker or Sellicks Beach.

Agree 100%