#VIS: Inner-City Stadium/Riverbank Precinct

[Tyler_Durden]

If Adelaide oval is so bad ,why is that it's rated one of the world's nicest cricket grounds?

It's considered nice because it is picturesque. It is picturesque because it doesn't have big stands or modern facilities in the way of the trees that border the Oval and it has mounds of grass for spectators to sit on. Being nice doesn't mean the facilities are good.

[BenJ]

If Adelaide oval is so bad ,why is that it's rated one of the world's nicest cricket grounds?

That's right cricket ground, not Soccer or AFL. It's not designed for these.

The only code that's mildly interested is Soccer, they already have Hindmarsh and don't have the fanbase to justify a new stadium.

As has been pointed out before soccer has a bright future in Australia and the Sydney vs Adelaide A League game showed us that 30,000 could quite happily turn up regularly for matches given a suitable, inner city venue. Along with everything else therefore, this stadium would be used almost all year round by the various codes.

AAMI stadiums would suffer and become empty.

Sell off the land, develop a new residential area and make a mint. Move Crows and Port games to the city.

The rail yards site (A) is just too small so forget that...

Telstra dome in Melbourne has a diameter of a bit under 0.35km and the railyards between North Tce/Port road and the river could fit a structure of this size almost perfectly.

Melbourne's A League team use the Telstra dome ( a multi purpose stadium) as their home and it's an excellent ground to view soccer due to the design and seating height, so no problem there.

[monotonehell]

The rail yards site (A) is just too small so forget that...

Telstra dome in Melbourne has a diameter of a bit under 0.35km and the railyards between North Tce/Port road and the river could fit a structure of this size almost perfectly.

Not quite enough room.

Unless you build it up above the train lines, in which case it would be very tall, cast a shadow over the Torrens lake area and cost a lot more. Also you need extra space for a car park and access roads.

[Omicron]

FIFA have a 125-page PDF file detailing the specific requirements of a given stadium to become FIFA-approved:

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/tournam ... n_8211.pdf

They are remarkably wide in their scope and quite detailed, and as you read through it all you begin to get an idea as to just how far away from FIFA approval AAMI Stadium would be, let alone Adelaide Oval.

[AtD]

Not quite enough room.

Unless you build it up above the train lines, in which case it would be very tall, cast a shadow over the Torrens lake area and cost a lot more. Also you need extra space for a car park and access roads.

You need to play Tetris more - it could be fit three times over on the rail yards.

[urban]

Unless you build it up above the train lines, in which case it would be very tall, cast a shadow over the Torrens lake area and cost a lot more.

Being south of the lake there would only be shading of the lake area in the early evening in the middle of summer.

[Wayno]

Not quite enough room.

Unless you build it up above the train lines, in which case it would be very tall, cast a shadow over the Torrens lake area and cost a lot more. Also you need extra space for a car park and access roads.

You need to play Tetris more - it could be fit three times over on the rail yards.

yeah, i also don't understand why people say it won't fit over the railyards. maybe just a bit of lateral thinking is required? perhaps reclaim some of the Torrens?

[Edgar]

Not quite enough room. Unless you build it up above the train lines, in which case it would be very tall, cast a shadow over the Torrens lake area and cost a lot more. Also you need extra space for a car park and access roads.

Seriously, you are sounding like a NIMBY

I am tired of the shadow issues, this is a CBD location we are talking about here, and honestly, over-shadow shouldn't be a major issues here, otherwise, our city would not have any high rise issue at all, and then the Hyatt and Convention Centre would be a big issue too.

Extra car park? What's wrong with building an above ground, above the rail lines car park adjacent to the stadium?

Access road? Look at the map, and you should see that there are plenty of access through Port Road via the northern, as well as from North Terrace.

Just to let you know, these 2 concerns are not in the priority list, why? Because the proposal or vision to have an inner city stadium is to overcome the two main concerns.

[Edgar]

And one more thing, if you have not already know, the sun rise from the east and sets at the west. The lake/torrens is on the north.

[Tyler_Durden]

FIFA have a 125-page PDF file detailing the specific requirements of a given stadium to become FIFA-approved:

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/tournam ... n_8211.pdf

They are remarkably wide in their scope and quite detailed, and as you read through it all you begin to get an idea as to just how far away from FIFA approval AAMI Stadium would be, let alone Adelaide Oval.

That's for the World Cup. Considering Australia's chances of getting the World Cup are pretty much zero we should not be spending too much money trying to get a stadium up to World Cup standard. The MCG fails under the same criteria as AAMI Stadium in that document (eg not all seats are undercover, spectators too far away from the pitch). And Melbourne's Telstra Dome fails too in that the spectators would be too far from the pitch. Ditto for Perth's proposed new stadium.

So what that document shows is that a multi purpose stadium would not be suitable for hosting World Cup matches because anything big enough for AFL football places the spectators too far away by FIFA's standard.

[rev]

Said it before, Australia doesn't have venues that meet FIFA requirements.
Take a look at other countries who have hosted the World Cup, or even the European Cup. They have all needed to build some new stadiums. Yet Australians think they can get away without building any and using some crapy, outdated, unsuitable AFL venues. :wank:

Clueless comes to mind. If these attitudes continue into the bid, don't expect too much other then FIFA to have a good laugh.

2022.

[Brando]

monotonehell, please clarify for me.
Are you for or against a new Stadium and where is your preference?

[Professor]

It's not going to happen so why talk about it? Adelaide oval is getting an upgrade and so is football park, both funded partially by the Govt. They will not look to support another competitor venue and where is the demand? And it will take more parklands so a vocal but powerful minority will fight it.

Anyway, Rann will be in power for another term after this one and he will not support or build it.

QED

[monotonehell]

You need to play Tetris more - it could be fit three times over on the rail yards.

Look at the picture. How can that fit? Remember, it needs to be orientated Solar North-South because that's the average direction that the Sun takes. Also there needs to be at least another 10% of space around a ground for normal ingress/egress / vomitorium / approach road / helipad reasons as well as room for emergency evacuation areas.

It's impossible to fit all that without going over the rail tracks.

Being south of the lake there would only be shading of the lake area in the early evening in the middle of summer.

I was going by the angle of the shadows in the picture, if you extend the sun lines from the top of the structure, in the evenings it would cast across the bank area west of Victoria bridge - not a huge concern, but still something to think of.

yeah, i also don't understand why people say it won't fit over the railyards. maybe just a bit of lateral thinking is required? perhaps reclaim some of the Torrens?

ANYTHING is possible given a shitload of money. Trying to cram a World Class stadium onto this site is ludicrous if you know anything about the requirements of stadium design. Actually doing it would require bags of money to redirect the train lines (there's two don't forget), raise the structure above the trainlines, rebuild the land, shift the Lake... it's all about cost.

Seriously, you are sounding like a NIMBY

If pointing out that that particular site is not suitable AND then suggesting FOUR alternative sites http://www.sensational-adelaide.com/for ... =90#p29668 is being a nimby then so be it.

I am tired of the shadow issues, this is a CBD location we are talking about here, and honestly, over-shadow shouldn't be a major issues here, otherwise, our city would not have any high rise issue at all, and then the Hyatt and Convention Centre would be a big issue too.

The shadow issue is just something to consider, the Hyatt and Convention centre are located on a line below the torrens lake, they only cast shadows over their own areas instead of over a potentially landscaped public area.

Extra car park? What's wrong with building an above ground, above the rail lines car park adjacent to the stadium?
Access road? Look at the map, and you should see that there are plenty of access through Port Road via the northern, as well as from North Terrace.

If there's not enough room on that site for the stadium and its apron, there's not enough room for a car park also. The only location I though of for an adjacent car park is across Port road on the playing field opposite. That's why I suggested option B (see my post above) instead of trying to cram a stadium onto the rail yards where it wont fit, why not put it on the ANI playing fields opposite?

By access roads I mean private roads around the stadium for service vehicles and so on, not public roadways to get to the carpark.

Just to let you know, these 2 concerns are not in the priority list, why? Because the proposal or vision to have an inner city stadium is to overcome the two main concerns.

This vision is trying to fit a size 12 foot into a size 10 shoe. Why not move the vision to a location that will FIT?

And one more thing, if you have not already know, the sun rise from the east and sets at the west. The lake/torrens is on the north

As I said above, the Sun doesn't follow magnetic East-West. It wanders across the sky from summer to winter. A stadium situated there WILL cast a shadow to the NE - NEE depending on the time of year.


You guys need to look at the facts and reconsider where you want this thing to go.
Look again at the space available:
http://www.sensational-adelaide.com/for ... 120#p29760

Look again at my alternative suggestions:
http://www.sensational-adelaide.com/for ... =90#p29668

Consider what you actually want:
* An AFL stadium?
* A Soccer stadium?
* A multi purpose stadium?
* A World class stadium?
* A FIFA compatible stadium?

First deciding on what you want is step one. No one has come to any conclusions over what they want here. There's many many different wishes and they seem to change depending on what argument they want to counter.

Once you've decided what you want and if it will fit where you want it. Then you have to see if there is the need for it.

There's just way too many questions so far, and all I'm hearing at this point is "we want one". Can we get past the "we want" stage and work out if we can have and then should have?

[Professor]

Ummmm

I just did this one so that I reached 50 posts.