If you want to live in a big, lively booming city......

[Matt]

Must be quick, because I'm bludging while at work, but will return later because it's always an interesting argument.

I'm leaving because Adelaide does not currently offer me what I want out of life.
I don't exist so as to serve Adelaide, and my own needs and priorities are more important to me than staying and trying to "do my part" to make a difference to the city's direction.

I don't see that as selfish, I see that as realistic.
My life is more important to me than some sort of loyalty to my home city.

[jk1237]

Its good for people to travel and experience other cities. I thought Adelaide was pretty shitty until I travelled around Europe and realised that we weren't a bad city at all. There is definitely a 'grass is greener on other side' syndrome with many South Australians. Id love to ask the average international student who is studying here whether they like it, caus they seem to.

What irks me is that virtually 80% of my old close friends now live in Sydney, Perth or London, who think that the lifestyle is way better and cooler, as they can walk down the street to a pub or cafe, and take great public transport everywhere, whereas here they think that doesnt happen. Funny thing about all this, is that all these friends lived with their parents in the outer suburbs of Adelaide, and they dont realise that if you live in the outer suburbs of the city they live in now, they will be just as bored as outer Adl. Most of my ex-pat Adl friends have got no idea about our city centre. There is only Rundle Mall, Rundle St and Hindley St to them, and because they have lived all their life in the outer sburbs, they dont know anything beyond these streets, yet they know everything about the city they live in now. Its crazy. If some of these ex-pat people actually explored their old hometown, like they are doing in their new city, they would be very very surprised.

[wilkiebarkid]

My penny's worth.

I left Adelaide in 1983 to go to Darwin of all places, because I was told it would escalate my career. And guess what? It did. I'm pretty sure most young people don't leave Adelaide because of it's lack of nightlife or attractions etc etc. They are going because there are more job opportunites, much higher salaries, and perhaps a chance to build a career and experience much faster than if they remained here.

I was in Adelaide up until the age of 23, and to be honest, I found the nightlife/morninglife very adequate (hic).

Many people return, as I have done, and so the cycle begins again. My daughter will probably end up interstate or overseas for career reasons, only to return eventually, when Adelaide's laidback lifestyle beckons and the family strings pull hard!

[cruel_world00]

^^^^ Cruel World I agree with everything you said in your post, and as I said I am leaving Adelaide for selfish reasons, pure and simple. But having said that, dont make me out to be a bad guy, because belive me im not the first one who has done so.
Unfortunatelly people in general are selfish beings (generalising here), and people will always want more than what they currently have. I am sure plenty of young people leave Melb and Syd as well to look for 'greener pastures', however those cities also have enough going for them to attract as many if not more young people than what leave the city, which Adelaide is struggling to do.

Ho Really, I completely understand where you are coming from, and agree with you 100%. If it was as easy as saying I want to become entrepreneurial and start a business etc today, belive me I would. I dont want to use the excuse of Im just one person, what difference can I make? but unfortunatelly I dont have the patience to wait till im 40 or 50 for Adelaide to become what I would like it to become. Unfortunatelly Adelaide just does not offer me what I want at this point in my life. Im sure though that in the future it will however, so as you said I will bring back my hard earned money, but also my life experience that I dont belive I could get here.

I know this is probably of little consellation, but being someone who was born in Eastern Europe I think that its a real shot in the arm that Adelaide does give young people the opportunity to be be able to get out there and experience the world, because lets face it if you live in 75% of the rest of the world these opportunities would not be available to us. My 2c.

I wasn't making you out to be the bad guy, I even made a point of saying "not just snorkie".

Generalisation on the comments after mine, I don't think you should exist to make Adelaide a better place, but don't knock the fact that it doesn't suit your lifestyle right now if you are leaving it to get more experience. Adelaide will only become what we want it to become by being involved. Leaving it high and dry will just, as I put it before, perpetuate the cycle. I guess those of you who are leaving to gain worldly experience are happy with the status quo of Adelaide being a place for families and not much else, which I guess if fine for people to think... I, however, do not want this. But that's just me.

[skyliner]

Me again - didn't finish before.

To resume - I want to come back to Adelaide after experiencing other places such as Sydney and Brisbane and several other places. There is plenty to do - even where I am (pop. 600 - 85 km out of Bris.)

Adelaide has a top future and will develop much further but needs the likes of you guys to help. It all depends on what you are looking for. I recognise that in the field of night life/entertainment there is a lot to go - but take it from an experienced rock muso, it's all coming - I would suggest through the great immigration of overseas students makling a market for entertainment - still got to catch up.

Adelaide has the most restuarants/cafes per head of pop of all capitals - this is good value - a different type of culture at night but a good one. I would rather do without the pokie culture after seeing it in NSW and what it does to individuals. (VERY experienced here).

Adelaide has a chance at getting the balance right without getting too corrupted in the process.

That's my 2 cents worth.

ADELAIDE - TOWARDS A GREATER CITY SKYLINE

[No Clever Alias]

I have to agree with Snorkie and Matt and share their sentiments about Adelaide.

Some context…

I grew up in the northern suburbs but now live in the eastern suburbs and work in the city. Most of my family lives in Adelaide, in the same northern suburbs I grew up in.

I'm a strategic urban planner and am well aware of both the potential and the failings of Adelaide. I have a lot of insight into the machinations of government and have knowledge of things many members on this website would love to know about (sometimes I wish I could just post some of what I know without jeopardising my career).

My friends are scattered throughout Australia and the world... Melbourne, Sydney, SE Asia, Dubai, Italy, UK (London and other cities), and North America... having moved for work opportunities or leisure, and some just to escape Adelaide. It is amazing to think of how many of my friends have left... all in their 20's and 30's, contributing to the creativity, innovation and vibrancy of other cities and the economy of other countries.

And I too will be leaving Adelaide in 2009, adding to the brain drain with my partner... another two tertiary educated, professional 20-somethings leaving to pursue greater work opportunities overseas. And I am unsure when or whether we will return to Adelaide.

Why?

I have an ambition to see Adelaide build upon its incredible potential, which is what drives me in my chosen career, but am enormously frustrated by the culture of both Adelaidians in general and the powerful decision-makers who shape the city.

It is a culture that is parochial, inwardly focused, often intolerant, and cliquey. It is one that accepts near enough as good enough; that second best is all we should hope to achieve.

Australians famously have a chip on their shoulder, a relic of a convict past and a struggle to establish ourselves on the world stage. And a friend of mine who moved here from the UK once put it to me that Adelaidians often have a chip on each shoulder, with our additional identity crisis in relation to Sydney and Melbourne historically and more recently even with Perth. Whether this is an explanation I don’t know, but where else in the world is a city of over 1 million people considered a country town!?! That cliché is often used as the excuse to justify a lack of progress, to excuse the backwardly looking culture that sees Adelaide stuck in a time warp of its own making.

Some people call me cynical, but some confuse cynicism with the power of observation.

I have spent the last seven years banging my head against a brick wall, pushing for more progress, innovation and a better future for Adelaide. And I’m tired of it. I’m tired of thinking and imagining what might be, knowing that it won’t be any time soon. So I am leaving to refresh myself and gain greater insights into the workings of cities in other parts of the world.

Some other observations…

There is a fundamental lack of vision by those in charge and making the decisions… I mean what the hell is South Australia’s Strategic Plan!?!

There is a general lack of understanding of how a city functions… I can lump many members of this website into that category.

There is no will to implement the plans and ideas put forward to progress the city… forget City of Churches, it should be Adelaide: City of Plans… but no implementation of course. That has no chance.

There are too many train spotters on this forum!

[Cruise]

Righto, i must be weirdo, only one of my friends have left adelaide.

"If you don't like it, move!" - "If it aint broke, why fix it?" - this is the sort of attitude some Adelaideans have that I detest.
There seems to be an attitude here that second best is good enough, instead of striving for the best outcomes possible.

Another one of my points, on this forum i have read comments like "why don't all the NIMBYs move to country towns so we can have a bustling city"

This shits me.


Now my favourite city is Melbourne, and yes i am let to leave Australia (though that will be different this time next year)

[Hippodamus]

moving the topic slightly, from city of adelaide to people of adelaide...for all us 20 somethings...

an older friend of mine from adelaide once told me, "Hippodamus, there are three types of people out there in Adelaide... there are the movie stars (people who are just too cool for school, very snobby, won't approach to say hi unless approached themselves, dress like they live in LA), the heros (fully sick thugs that hang around in packs to feel better about themselves, they don't dance usually - just linger like hawks looking for something to do or someone to bash etc) and then there is the private school clique (nautica wearing, collars up, hang around only with people from same private school, have a snobby pub meeting spot for all of them to congregate, you can spot these guys out a mile away)".

my older friend then explained "who ever you find outside any of these categories - is worth making your friend".

i really liked this crude, yet believable explanation, i think it's a great sum up of our youth culture. not incredibly diverse in my opinion - probably due to much of the brain drain talked about in this forum. unfortunately, the people described in the 3 categories tend to stick around and some new generations conform to them as they grow and dominate in numbers and presence. the brain drain is much of the innovative, intelligent and unique individuals that leave.

gross generalisation, i know it is very crude and i don't neccessarily believe it to the full extent, just some of my thoughts, what do you guys think?

[crawf]

Okay I think its time I voice my opinion on this.

First of I am really starting to get sick of hearing people whinge that their school/uni friends are planning to or have moved interstate/overseas and thinking its a Adelaide only problem when this isn't the case. Not many people stay in the town/city they grew up in (I'm one of them) however because there alot more job opportunities offering big salaries interstate and overseas its affecting Adelaide quite bad at the moment.

Though with the states growing resources and defence sector, things here are set to change for the better. Because its going to mean more job opportunities with higher salaries in many industries which will entice a greater number of locals staying and more people moving to Adelaide & SA.

Personally theres a high chance I'll be leaving Adelaide in the next month or so probably most likely Darwin. While the city does offer a fantastic lively nightlife and has a very bright short-term future, the main reasons why I'm thinking of moving there is because I want to travel and experience new things, Darwin has alot of job opportunities and the salaries are much higher up there plus I'm a tad sick of the cold weather here . However I'm not leaving Adelaide because I hate the place, I just wanna build myself a nice career so I can come back to Adelaide and buy myself my own home. Also I'm not one of those people who like to stay in the same place, I like to travel and do new things.

While Adelaide already has alot to offer it does need a shakeup, but then again I am definitely noticing quite a few changes around Adelaide. Such as the city becoming more busier (even past 7pm in winter), more people living in the CBD, better population growth (despite the large number of people leaving the state), more construction in Adelaide, a emerging southern CBD plus much more (such as transport projects). However this city is set for the biggest makeover in decades such as...
- SA Government will FINALLY electrify the train lines incl 50 new trains (except Belair for now)
- Long term plan for 11 TOD developments
- Tramline extension to the entertainment centre with a 800 space park n ride so people will be able to catch the tram for a small fee (completed next year).
- Plans to extend it to West Lakes/Port Adelaide/Semaphore which will kick start urban renewal and create new opportunities in the north western suburbs.
- O'bahn interchange upgrades and many other PT upgrades (new ticketing system)

These projects are going to give Adelaide a frequent state of the art Public Transport system and make PT a more attractive option of transport which in the long run will make Adelaide more of a better city to be. Then ofcourse as we all know then theres the growing resources and defence sector which will transform our so called 'rust belt' state into a economic powerhouse and create plenty of high paying jobs in many sectors (especially mining and defence).

Other projects though not as attractive as the ones above include new prisons (replacing Yatala & Magill), expanding Mt Bold Reservoir, Densal plant for Port Stanvac, new $1.7bn city hospital and major upgrades to other hospitals, school projects and more. These projects will give Adelaide a better water, education, law & order and health system which is important to any city.

my

[Wayno]

Clearly, people move away from every city worldwide every day. Their reasons are various and common. Adelaide is not special in this respect. Interestingly, the vast majority of Explorers eventually return (after expanding their horizons and finding themselves). The pull of home is very strong in most of us. It was for me - i was away for 12 years, and brought back a family notch 3 up for SA population growth!

The simple issue to date has been that more people depart SA than arrive each year. This is mainly due to us historically lacking a vibrant & growing business industry (as just about everything else flows once you have momentum in that respect). This trend is obviously slowing and will soon reverse.

My advice: don't go away for too long - turning points are fun times!

[Will409]

I must be odd in that I am planning of staying put here in Adelaide and make something of myself here. Well, someone has to.

Until I joined this site, I would probably have had the same general stereotype opinion of Adelaide as portrayed by the other states. Now that I have seen that there are good times for this state coming, I am hoping to stay put and make something of myself here. I am already a qualified mechanic (at a Cert 1 level) and I am currently studying in Cert 4 in IT Multimedia at TAFE. With the developement of both mining and defence here in SA, both fields (to a certain degree) will be much in demand.

As much as I like to see preservation and conservation of various things (for instance, I am greatful that a total of 8 of the H class trams that were sold a couple of years ago are preserved in operational order in various tramway musuems around the country), I am atleast smart enough to release that the status quo doesn't last forever and I do enjoy seeing change setting into this fair city of ours. If everyone leaves, nothing will get done and the result is that the NIMBY's win. If everyone around my age decides to leave, then what shall become of Adelaide and South Australia?

Having travelled to Sydney, Canberra, Melbourne and Alice Springs in my time, I never cease to be amazed by the sheer beauty of Adelaide. The only city out of all those I have listed that comes close to Adelaide is Melbourne. The wide, plane tree lined, streets in the gird pattern that we have been blessed with makes Adelaide a sheer joy to negotiate as well as admire. While we have lost the reputation of a "20 minute" city, it atleast doesn't take 3 hours to get from the suburbs to the CBD like it does in Sydney. Everything is close by also. Within an hour or so to the north and south of the CBD, you are in wine country. To the west, the numerous beaches that are within easy reach by public transport. Largs, Semaphore, Glenelg and to a lesser extent, Brighton. To the east, the Adelaide Hills which remind me heavily of the lakes district in the UK. How many other places offer this much? I cannot imagine a better place to live in this country. After decades of hardship, Adelaide is finally throwing off it's shackles and will once again be a force to be reckoned with. I am not going to miss the chance to see my beloved city and state grow.

Once a croweater, always a croweater.

[Wayno]

I am already a qualified mechanic (at a Cert 1 level)...

My suggestion: do some extra training to become a diesel mechanic, then you'll be earning some v-good $$$ courtesy of the mining industry...

[AtD]

The only city out of all those I have listed that comes close to Adelaide is Melbourne.

Adelaide and Melbourne are very similar, as I posted elsewhere. If you compare their histories to that of any other city in Australia, Adelaide is basically a mini-Melbourne.

[Will409]

Depending how my current IT course goes and if I don't get a job in that, then that is what I will do (infact, that is my first option). I have already applied several apprenticeships for heavy diesel but I havn't made it into the industry yet. However, it is atleast a start.

[Cruise]

Cert 1 (in i'm guessing automotive) does NOT make you a mechanic.