[COM] 413 KWS Vue on King William | 89m | 28Lvl | Residential

[Ben]

Here it is. Seems there won't be any action on this site any time soon.

[UrbanSG]

This is what I have been worried about for over 6 months. You can't have large stockmarket falls without fallout. Especially considering the poor banking situation at the current time.

Hmmm, late 80's, early 90's repeating again. At least the vacancy rates aren't as high at the moment as they were then and we have a more positive economic outlook for our State.

I expect this one will possibly be downsized dramatically just to cater for Hills tenancy requirements on not built at all. If that is the case, it will be a shame but at least Ben will retain his views

[Shuz]

Nawww, wha? This sucks man.

[Just build it]

Damn shame but probably only one of many developments that'll be held back, downgraded or fall over completely in the next 6 months. Last week it was 17 to 7 levels, this one may become 15 to 5.

[Will]

I will be really pissed off if this project is dumbed down into a 3000sqm2 tenancy to cater solely for Hills. It would represent a huge wasted opportunity on what is a prime KWS site.

To expand on what UrbanSG said, I think that this is just the tip of the iceberg. Proposed office buildings which have no pre-commitment are pretty much dead (42-56 Franklin Street, 73-79 Pirie Street, Aurora on Pirie West Tower and sadly 20-22 Currie Street..... )

[crawf]

While this had a brilliant design, though downsizing may not be a bad thing. I never liked the fact that this was going to be the same size as Optus, which was going to create a mini wall along KWS.

I would rather the future tower behind Brecknock Hotel or 379 KWS around 60m instead.

BTW I think its way to early to suggest other office developments are dead

[Will]

While this had a brilliant design, though downsizing may not be a bad thing. I never liked the fact that this was going to be the same size as Optus, which was going to create a mini wall along KWS.

I would rather the future tower behind Brecknock Hotel or 379 KWS around 60m instead.

BTW I think its way to early to suggest other office developments are dead

Crawf, it is great that you are being positive, but if this project which had tenant pre-commitment has fallen over, what hope do other projects with no tenant pre-commitment have in the current economic situation?

Particularly some of the larger ones which I have mentioned such as 42-56 Franklin Street and 73-79 Pirie Street which have around 30 000sqm2 of office space. Not to mention 20-22 Currie Street which has around 50 000sqm2 of office space!

Back to this building, although unlikely, I hope Hills decides to proceed with this building by themselves. The whole purpose of this building was to present an impressive HQ to potential business partners or clients. Furthermore by the time of this buildings completion in early 2010, it appears that the economy should have improved and thus a tenant may be easier to find then. Probably wishful thinking....

[UrbanSG]

I tend to agree with crawf. Whilst this is a great building it really won't add to Adelaide's skyline being so close to Optus.

The other buildings across the road will have a more substantial impact despite their lower height imo. That being said I still would have liked to see this one go ahead, who knows it may stll go ahed according to the current plans.

This is why a lot of pre-commitments are kept quiet for a fair while too because when things go wrong like this it is very embarrassing for a company involved in the project. Remember the big deal made about this last year eg the ACC press release etc, it was all too much and was real 'boom' time wank.

Other office projects definately won't go ahead in the current climate. Way too many are proposed for Adelaide at present anyway. I hope people did not expect they would all go ahead. The question now is how many will go ahead.

Proposals in the core CBD eg the Franklin proposal CCT8 are far more likely to proceed because of their location and relatively low rents in comparison to other cities around Australia. Major companies that are seeking space at the moment will sign up to these towers not the others proposed just outside the core CBD area.

Interesting times ahead. Although economic downturns are not fun they do flush out a lot of the poorly managed deals and companies and return investment to more sustainable levels. Hopefully SA's reasonable ecomomic outlook helps us out this time unlike the early 90's.

[crawf]

Particularly some of the larger ones which I have mentioned such as 42-56 Franklin Street and 73-79 Pirie Street which have around 30 000sqm2 of office space. Not to mention 20-22 Currie Street which has around 50 000sqm2 of office space!

Well 73-79 Pirie Street would be no major loss at all, never liked that proposal. I rather wait for a few years for a well designed high rise (100m+) to be proposed when economic times improve, then have some cheap boring box built now.
However I would be deeply sadden if 20-22 Currie St was axed.

]Other office projects definately won't go ahead in the current climate. Way too many are proposed for Adelaide at present anyway. I hope people did not expect they would all go ahead. The question now is how many will go ahead.

Proposals in the core CBD eg the Franklin proposal CCT8 are far more likely to proceed because of their location and relatively low rents in comparison to other cities around Australia. Major companies that are seeking space at the moment will sign up to these towers not the others proposed just outside the core CBD area.

As much as how disappointing that prediction sounds, alot of these office buildings that have been proposed in the last couple of years have been bland, boring and boxy which were hardly going to do anything to improve the skyline. So really it will be no loss if some of these projects never get off the ground and the sites are set aside for future buildings with good height and decent designs. Though on the down side, they would of increased density and liveness in the CBD

While I do believe they are going to be more projects to be canceled or downsized as the short time future isn't bright at the moment, I think we shouldn't jump the gun and say all projects around the city are going to be axed just yet.

BTW if anyone is wondering there has been a few major projects interstate that have been axed, such as a 180m tower in Perth.

[ynotsfables]

Could this be the end of our building boom for quite some years now?
Adelaide doesn't seem to have had much luck through out history if you consider it, if the state bank isn'nt collapsing then the global stock markets will crash instead, if the stock markets don't crash then the nimby's attack.
Lets hope that mining and defence projects will get us back on our feet.

[jk1237]

There does seem to be a vibe that a mini recession is almost on us. Interesting to see how this goes against the mining boom. The USA's current credit flu is somehow only seeing minor symptons here, so hopefully we keep up our Vitamin C .
This downturn hopefully will only last a couple of years if that, where 1 or 2 tower projects will naturally collapse. I still reckon we are doing very well with CBD construction activity though, and we still have low office vacacy rates. We may be in a better position than Syd or Melb too, due to the potential mining stuff we have.

Im actually a bit excited about all the negative vibes from economists, caus hopefully the CBA will lower my mortgage interest rates

[skyliner]

Well..what a pain! Such a top location too for a bldg of impact.

Be encouraged however, our economic position is still quite good. Brisbane has had heaps of projects axed - overdone I suspect in the first place. Looking at the mining site and a quick comparison to QLD - thery have 30 coal mines and a smattering of others. Wayno's list for SA is stunning. Biggest increase in mining workers (for 2008 - 9) will be here in OUR state guys. (Stated by someone else - not sure of the thread). However, this could be dampened by the unfortunate fact that SA responds heavily to economic downturns.

If this project's financiers can see through the economic morass and research into the abovementioned factors there may yet be a good sized bldg here in the future.

Of note - I remember my brother (a CFO in a big company with HQ in SA) had said to me in January that there were problems in financing this bldg. This happened in Jan this year.(posted by me on this thread then). So not surprised - just unhappy about it.

ADELAIDE - TOWARDS A GREATER CITY SKYLINE

[Mants]

you win some, you lose some

pity though.

[AtD]

The fundamentals for commercial property are still good, vacancy rates are low and there's no over-supply like there was in the 1990's. It's the "credit flu" as jk called it. The Goodman Group got hit hard by being over-leveraged.

[Shuz]

I think a lot of people are jumping the gun a bit with recession and economical downsizing fears, SA is actually performing the best or 2nd best nationally to other states against the economic climate at present. This whole subject was only just brought up in the last week with consumer confidence nationwide drastically down (4%) I think, but SA was up 0.2%, small, but positive. The mining potential is staggering, and with those sectors consistently surging due to unprecedented Chinese and Indian demand - there'll be tens and hundreds of mines commencing, expanding, etc. in the next 2-5 years. The high cost of resources will offset the financial turmoul which should see us through the hiccup that the rest of the nation is going through. There's actually an article in the paper which indicates that the project isn't dead, Hills are already in talks with 2 local finaciers to make sure it goes through, and they are adamant to see it through as a commitment to Adelaide. It did mention if they were setting up in Sydney or Melbourne they would have given up, so its not all doom and gloom. The Knights report issued last week or before still makes positive news for the other projects like the Pirie St and Franklin towers even though at a latter date (2010+). So I'm not going to jump the negative bandwagon and watch the conditions through until some serious shit hits the fan. But what are those chances?