[DEF] AAMI Stadium Upgrade | $100m | 52,000

[ricecrackers]

I just don't believe the immense cost justifies the means.

do you think spending $100 million on AAMI stadium justifies the means?

[Cruise]

Do you ever make a post that is not sarcastic in some way or you trying to be funny?

No.

Here's a suggestion, since you apparently have some doubts.
Go to Rundle Street, and ask the owners of the cafes and bars, if they see an increase in trade during "Mad March".
Then ask them if they would rather the Fringe etc, were not held.

Maybe that will knock some sense into you.

so building a new inner city stadium will be the silver bullet so to speak to keep activity like that seen during Mad March going during the 22 weekends of the year that AFL is played?

[Cruise]

I just don't believe the immense cost justifies the means.

do you think spending $100 million on AAMI stadium justifies the means?

I will wait until i see the plans that i heard will be released in December about the upgrade before i say it is or isn't a waste of money.

[ricecrackers]

I just don't believe the immense cost justifies the means.

do you think spending $100 million on AAMI stadium justifies the means?

I will wait until i see the plans that i heard will be released in December about the upgrade before i say it is or isn't a waste of money.

that's a fair call. only way i can see it will is if it attracts more corporate sponsors as a result of improved facilities, and that extra sponsorship pays for the investment over time. i very much doubt that it will increase crowds to games, at least not for a sustained period, and i just cant see how it will attract more major events to the venue. i just cant see it. maybe i just lack vision.

[Professor]

I neveer have a problem grtting to Football Park. It's a bit daggy but OK as a stadium. ASdelaid Oval is realoy nice and Hindmarsh Stadium OK if you like watching a game fr 90 minutes where no-one scores a goal.

Not sure what all the fuss is about. Most peope drive to see the game (about a third go by bus) so it's either drive into town to an oval or drive from town to an oval.

If the government has a laxy $200m sitting around waiting to be assigned to a project, there are mucgh higher priorities in Adelaide and SA.

... and Australia will not get the World Cup in 2018 - that is just a political stunt so please, no red herrings.

[ricecrackers]

I neveer have a problem grtting to Football Park. It's a bit daggy but OK as a stadium. ASdelaid Oval is realoy nice and Hindmarsh Stadium OK if you like watching a game fr 90 minutes where no-one scores a goal.

Not sure what all the fuss is about. Most peope drive to see the game (about a third go by bus) so it's either drive into town to an oval or drive from town to an oval.

If the government has a laxy $200m sitting around waiting to be assigned to a project, there are mucgh higher priorities in Adelaide and SA.

... and Australia will not get the World Cup in 2018 - that is just a political stunt so please, no red herrings.

will all respect thats kind of narrow thinking

whether you like it or not Soccer is the biggest sport in the world by far... by far.

and it is growing as a sport in this country

the world cup bid is not a political stunt. it was started by the FFA. Australia may not get it in 2018, but 2022 is a serious chance.

Adelaide United just made the semis of the Asian Champions League. that might not have registered on your radar, but that is a big deal. there are millions perhaps billions of soccer fans throughout Asia that would give a lot for their local team to be in this position. thats why i think the sport deserves some investment in infrastructure. many more people internationally are aware of our soccer team than both of our AFL teams combined. eventually that will translate locally.

i know from personal experience too its far easier to get PT into the city than to anyway else. the city also has the highest concentration of residential population than anywhere else in the metro area. this is something which has occurred in the last 5 years. thats not even taking into account the 100 thousand or so that work in the CBD during the week.

most people are lazy nowadays and would prefer to go to an event on their doorstep than travel any distance. Melbourne has proven that. but i dont think we should spend a billion dollars on a stadium either. this is Adelaide, and Wembley didnt even cost that much.

as far as i understand the main issue preventing a new rectangular stadium being built in or near the CBD is the availability of land, as the planned hospital has taken the only available spot.

[Wayno]

I went to the Sturt/Glenelg SANFL match today at Adelaide Oval. What a pleasure! 13,800 people basking in the afternoon sunshine. The match started at 3pm so a few mates and myself went for lunch in the city first, whilst the wives did a bit of shopping. After the match we all wandered back up KWS (as did several hundred others) to the city for more frivolity and jocularity.

We would have stayed home if the match was at AAMI...

[Cruise]

I am going to next weeks grand final, i don't support either team but i'm going to support the leauge.
oh and i don't give a hoot that it is at Football Park, Adelaide Oval or even the on bloody moon.i would be going nonetheless.

Oh and i didn't know you couldn't shop at West lakes :wank: :wank:

[monotonehell]

I'm not saying he's right, I'm not saying he's wrong. But...

I think everyone should take a step back and really READ Prince George's last post:
http://www.sensational-adelaide.com/for ... 300#p49837

And then think about it. Don't just pick on single points as we've all done, actually think about his whole point. He makes a very good point. Comparing Mad March to Footy Game doesn't work, its a completely different type of patronisation with different priorities. His point regarding the influence of Footy Park on West Lakes deserves some thought and response.

For a long time we've been working on the idea that an inner city stadium will bring inner city benefits. But will it really? He makes a good point about the inward facing nature of a stadium with regard to the railyards.


I think that we've all be arguing this topic for way too long, and are possibly set in our positions. We need to wipe the slate clean and really think it through. Don't come to the forum on the stadium unless you're willing to have a rational position, have valid arguments for and against your position, and are willing to have your mind changed.

There's way too many facts that we don't really know here to actually come to a proper conclusion. What would be nice is if the government came out with an unbiased study into the pros and cons of a future inner city stadium. A proper costs and benefits study that lays out what we can have for what cost and what return.

* Purpose built V Multi purpose
* Location
* Capital cost and where the money would come from (public purse, commercial venture or PPP)
* Capacity and facilities needed - a REAL list of events that would make use of it (as opposed to an aspirational list)
* A study into the flow on effects into the CBD, both positive and negative.
* A study into the PT needed, the parking required and the upgrades needed to local roads to get private vehicles in and out of the venue (think of the traffic chaos a big event at Adelaide Oval causes).

And a lot of others I can't think of right now.

We don't have the answers. There's NO point continuing to debate this from our points of ignorance. If anyone's serious about getting a inner cbd stadium, they should organise themselves not to demand one, but to demand that the govt commission a study into one. Otherwise you'll go blue in the face arguing.

[rev]

I understand what he is saying, and if the suggestion was to build a new stadium anywhere else but the CBD, then I would agree.
But the fact remains, West Lakes is just another suburb, it is not a major point of interest, and the only things to do at West Lakes are go to a game at AAMI, or to Westfield which is hardly anything writing home about. It's just another shopping center.

The CBD is so much more then just a suburb. It is the center of life in Adelaide. It is the economic and entertainment heart of the state. It is where Adelaides night life is.

I don't know how anyone can not see that having a few tens of thousands of fans practically every weekend(when our CBD really is open at night for young people), attending sports at a city stadium, and then heading out for a night on the town, would be a big boost for the cbd.
Isn't this what we all want, from the residents of this city to the local city council to the government? More people in the city?

I will wait until i see the plans that i heard will be released in December about the upgrade before i say it is or isn't a waste of money.

So I guess your not prepared to see plans for an inner city stadium, let alone how much it will actually cost, before making your mind up that it's a waste of money?

Professor, Australia will be hosting a World Cup in our lifetime sooner then you may think. 2022, I guarantee it right now. If I was a betting man, I'm that certain, I'd put everything I own on the line.
The argument isn't to build a stadium now, today. But rather then spending 100 million upgrading AAMI stadium, which even with the upgrades(trust me on this) wont meet FIFA requirements, and they know this, so in reality it's just a 100 million dollar tax payer funded gift to the SANFL who really don't deserve 1 cent of tax payers money, to actually take into consideration the possibility of building a new stadium.
I agree, there are bigger priorities like our hospitals and transport infrastructure. But we are talking about a stadium in ten years time.
For them to flat out say no, is irresponsible.
We don't expect 1 billion dollars to be given for a new stadium this moment.
What we expect is our elected representatives to listen to what we are saying, and this is the majority saying it, and to at least allow for the possibility to consider building a new stadium in the near future.



Oh and now that I remembered it, someone said building a new stadium for Adelaide United won't improve crowds.
I give you the example of Melbourne Victory.
They played at Olympic park, a stadium worse then Hindmarsh. Poor crowds.
They then moved their home games to Telstra Dome. Guess what? Crowds improved immediately, and dramatically. They were the benchmark. They set the new benchmark.

An inner city stadium wont attract more crowds to Adelaide United games?
Example, A League match vs Sydney FC. Venue was Adelaide Oval - inner city stadium.
Crowd? Improved substantially. They were turning people away. Just imagine if it was at a venue were you were close to the action, how many more would have gone.

So far the only semi valid argument against a new multi purpose inner city stadium is the cost, and that is only a guess as nobody has drawn up any plans for such a stadium yet, so that argument really can't be used as we don't know how much it will cost.

[ricecrackers]

well my argument against a multipurpose city stadium is this...

the SANFL own AAMI stadium. they're making a profit from it, why would they want to pay rent that eats into their bottom line?

SANFL, that is AFL games, should stay at West Lakes. I've already become disenfranchised from AFL football in SA so i could care less than i do, but it makes absolute sense for AFL games to remain at West Lakes while they're still turning a profit.

The SANFL have stated clearly they want to remain at AAMI. They didnt even ask for the $100 million so why should it be given to them? Its been given to AAMI stadium to supposedly make it FIFA standard for any world cup bid, however Adelaide United wont play their matches there on a regular basis so what legacy will it leave? This completely goes against the FIFA philosophy for staging world cups and would only hamper an Australian bid if it were included at all.

Melbourne are investing in a new CBD area rectangular 31000 seat stadium which is going to cost $268 million. No doubt it will be designed such that it can be extended to 40000 seat if the need arises.

I take the point about the need for a proper study being done for all the major sporting infrastructure in this state. That really should be done as i believe the throwing of $100 million at AAMI is completely financially irresponsible at this stage as i believe no such research has been done and the real reason was knee-jerk politically motivated to quieten the sport obsessed masses who had turned green after the Western Australian government went public with its plans to build a multipurpose super stadium.

maybe the AFL in Adelaide is on borrowed time,

note hair colour of most supporters...

[monotonehell]

I don't think the Mil$100 thrown at AAMI (Footy park damit! ) is that much of a concern. The inner city standium is at least 10 years away. We do need a facility in the interim.

You can still have a future ICS (yes yes? Inner City Stadium? ) and a facelift for AAMI.


So like I said there's no point arguing amongst ourselves. Form an action group and call for a Govt study.

[ricecrackers]

I don't think the Mil$100 thrown at AAMI (Footy park damit! ) is that much of a concern. The inner city standium is at least 10 years away. We do need a facility in the interim.

You can still have a future ICS (yes yes? Inner City Stadium? ) and a facelift for AAMI.


So like I said there's no point arguing amongst ourselves. Form an action group and call for a Govt study.

the facelift at AAMI is not needed. it'll only make the supporters feel older.

the action group already exists, its called the "Sensational Adelaide Forum"

i suggest a thread as a petition calling for a govt study into sporting infrastructure with a list of issues grievances we can all at least agree on. the study can then be done and the consultant can come up with the options. or we could, but for much cheaper.

[monotonehell]

I don't think the Mil$100 thrown at AAMI (Footy park damit! ) is that much of a concern. The inner city standium is at least 10 years away. We do need a facility in the interim.

You can still have a future ICS (yes yes? Inner City Stadium? ) and a facelift for AAMI.


So like I said there's no point arguing amongst ourselves. Form an action group and call for a Govt study.

the facelift at AAMI is not needed. it'll only make the supporters feel older.

the action group already exists, its called the "Sensational Adelaide Forum"

i suggest a thread as a petition calling for a govt study into sporting infrastructure with a list of issues grievances we can all at least agree on. the study can then be done and the consultant can come up with the options. or we could, but for much cheaper.

The "Sensational Adelaide Forum" is arguing amongst ourselves. I meant form a group as we have done in the past and are currently doing on other issues:
http://www.sensational-adelaide.com/for ... m.php?f=19
http://www.sensational-adelaide.com/for ... m.php?f=20

[ricecrackers]

ok do it. i'm just a sens rookie with too many ideas, too many arguments and unable to sleep!