RE: Anticipated drop in international Students Numbers

[sacred_june]

Just quickly thought i'd make a small point re the title above.
The topic came up in a CBD development thread but i thought id start this topic here so as to not get too off-topic.

I live in melbourne these days, and the constant news about "indian/racial bashings" is endless.
Just when it seems to go away, another story surfaces.
All this publicity is obviously going to have a detrimental affect on the number of inter. students, but what really annoys me is how the media is making these incidents out to be "hate crimes"

i dont think they all are racial crimes. People in Melbourne/Sydney get bashed for no apparent reason every weekend, regardless of their heritage.
When Ron Barassi got attacked, he wasnt a victim of "Hatred towards the elderly" ... he was just the unfortunate victim of another unnecessary beating on the streets by some young punks.
These drunk/drugged kids go around beating people up because they have no respect for anybody. And everybody is a target, not just international students.
Basically, if you're walking the streets alone late at night and look at the wrong guy the wrong way, you could be attacked.

It really annoys me though, that when an indian student gets bashed, it gets branded a "hate crime" when it's not.
I dont what to come across the wrong way and seem like i dont care, cos i do, i think it's madness what's happening here and it has to stop, but the media arent helping by hyping up the story simply to get higher ratings.
They should just report the facts, and stop abusing the public's trust to get more viewers.

End Rant.

[Wayno]

has there been much of this in Adelaide? i seem to remember 1-2 cases in the media a while ago, but nothing recent.

Sacred June, where do most of the international students live in Melbourne? In Adelaide, it seems the majority are housed in or near the city centre.

I also recently saw a news article where Robert Doyle blamed the bogans who converge on the city on fri/sat night for most of the violence - is this a fair summary?

[sacred_june]

Most students live as close as possible to their school or university. So there's no real "indian suburb" or anything like that. Some of my indian friends who i work with live in east brighton (a very nice part of town) and others live in Sunshine (not so nice)

melbourne is a bit different to adelaide in the sense that young people dont have to go to the city on a friday/saturday night to "Go Out". there are many night spots, including in the suburbs, whereas adelaide's nightclubs are mostly concentrated in a few areas of the city. having said that, Melbourne on a saturday night is a crazy place, there's no doubting. Im only 22, so i'm no conservative old fart, and sometimes after work on a sat night (say 2am sunday morning) i'll drive into the city to go out, and even when in my car, i've really gotta concentrate to try not to hit any "bogans" jumping infront of my car. The streets are full of drunk kids, and i say kids cos a good percentage of them wouldnt even be 18. With all the alcohol and testosterone flying around the place, im not surprised that people get hurt often. The same goes for Fitzroy st or Chapel st on the weekends

[Wayno]

i'm no conservative old fart

conservative young fart? only joking...

I was speaking about 1hr ago with my work colleagues in India (Pune & Bangalore). These are worldly business guys who are well educated and well travelled (including Syd/Melb/Adel). We spoke about this topic and interestingly, the guys said they are also disgusted with their own local media who increasingly reporting 'westernised sensationalist crap' (their words - not mine).

They say the India media has been particularly harsh about the treatment of Indian students in Australia. Seems this issue will continue until firm action is taken here in Australia or these 'news' stories fail to sell more newspapers - whichever comes first).

[stumpjumper]

Good point, sacred-june.

An attack does not necessarily equal a hate crime. It's more likely to be a simple case of strong and ruthless meets vulnerable.

In the case of attacks on Indian students, many commentators bring attitudes to the matter which affect what they say.

For example, it's not politically correct for anyone to use the word Islam in this context.

The universities and the government want to keep up the income from foreign students, so they will play down the whole thing.

The media won't fan the 'Muslim versus Hindu' flames, so they go for the next best lurid headline - 'hate crime' - and let readers jump to conclusions.

[AtD]

In today's AFR it was noted that applications for Uni places have increased across the nation (Victoria is yet to release their figures). WA up 12% on last year, QLD up 11%, Tas up 7%, SA up 4% and NSW/ACT up 2%. International applications numbers are not yet available but SATAC has reported an increase in applications of 6% on last year.

Also, Adelaide Uni is now ranked in the worlds top 100 universities, according to the 2009 Times Higher Education QS world university rankings, up 25 places to rank 81st (overtaking Uni of WA). All the Group of Eight are now in the world top 100.

17 ANU
36 Sydney, Melbourne (tied)
41 Queensland
45 Monash
47 NSW
81 Adelaide
84 WA
http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/R ... op200.html

[Prince George]

Interesting list, AtD. By an interesting coincidence (well, interesting to the Queen and I), the University of Adelaide was rated just behind the Univesity of Washington (aka "u-dub"), who are just a couple of miles down the road from us. Comparing the scores gives a little snapshot of how differently these two universities were ranked. The 7 scores are:

1. Peer review score
2. Employer review score
3. Staff/Student ratio score
4. Citations/Staff score
5. International staff score
6. International student score
7. Overall score

The categories are explained here; the two that I felt were most interesting were the Peer Review (a measure how highly regarded the university is by academics around the world) and Citations/Staff (based on how often papers published by the university are cited by other researchers, divided by the amount of staff that the university has)

Code: Select all

                                         1  2  3  4  5  6  7
80 59   University of Washington US      83 46 45 99 25 36 71.1 
81 106= University of Adelaide Australia 78 87 38 62 87 96 70.8 

So Washington was ranked somewhat higher than Adelaide by the peer review, and far higher in terms of how often their research was cited, but Adelaide was ranked higher by employers, and had a higher ratio of staff and students from overseas. Looking across all the Australian entrants is very interesting

Code: Select all

                                                   1  2  3  4  5  6  7
17 16  Australian National University  Australia 100  91 75 74 99 92 90.5 
36= 38 University of Melbourne         Australia 100 100 57 61 59 97 83.1 
36= 37 University of Sydney            Australia  99  97 58 53 99 95 83.1  
41 43  University of Queensland        Australia  94  95 47 67 99 82 80.7  
45 47  Monash University               Australia  98  99 56 42 95 96 80.0 
47= 45 University of New South Wales   Australia  96  99 39 62 82 93 79.0   
81 106 University of Adelaide          Australia  78  87 38 62 87 96 70.8
84 83= University of Western Australia Australia  72  81 50 63 99 87 70.2 

I'm really struck by the way that the peer-review scores for the top six in the list are so much higher than Adelaide or UWA, and yet the citations-per-staff scores are basically flat across all the universities. Indeed Adelaide's is significantly better than Monash's or Sydney's, yet they were each scored so much better by academics.

[vik_man]

well I was under the impression that if the "racial" incidents reduced Melbourne and Sydney's international enrolments, this could mean more of them coming to Adelaide instead?

I'm not too sure if the incidents were internationally reported as more of a Melbourne/Sydney issue, or an Australian issue.

[Queen Anne]

I'm not too sure if the incidents were internationally reported as more of a Melbourne/Sydney issue, or an Australian issue.

Adelaide was mentioned by name (along with Sydney and Melbourne) on my local public radio station as one of the Australian cities to have had these attacks. It was a story from the BBC World Service, so I guess that means it went all over the place. It was a shame to hear Adelaide mentioned in this context.

[AtD]

The application numbers so far suggest it was a storm in a teacup as far as international enrollments are concerned. Demand will outstrip supply again this year.

[Vee]

For what it's worth, this recent report suggests that Australia is seen as a relatively safe destination for international students, accrding to a poll of Indian students.
Australia 'safest for Indian students'
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,26 ... 77,00.html

26 % of a poll of 1130 Indian students ranked Australia as the number one nation for safety, followed by Great Britain & Canada 20 % and New Zealand 13%.
Top vote (19%) went to Australia for best government policies to protect international students.
Results of a wider survey are due out soon.

[jk1237]

The Indian population in Adelaide seems to have exploded in the last few years. Drive down Prospect Rd and all around Enfield/Blair Athol / Kilburn there are lots of Indian based shops. The best Indian food is on Main North Rd opposite the Enfield Plaza (where Harvey Norms used to be). Infact Prospect Rd is cool, its so underated. Between Grand Junc Rd and Regency Roads the various cultures and the busy-ness of the shopping strip is so cosmopolitan and I love the old shopping strip in Prospect which has quite a few cool cafes

[Brando]

http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/stor ... 01,00.html

Students find Adelaide a safe haven

ADELAIDE'S international students have given the city a ringing endorsement, rating it the safest Australian capital in which to study.

Student placement organisation IDP Education surveyed 6000 students at universities and schools across Australia. Adelaide was rated as safer, more friendly, cleaner, greener, quieter and more affordable than any other city.

IDP Education chief executive Tony Pollock said: "Sydney and Melbourne may have the big city, multicultural flavour, but international students have ranked Adelaide, Brisbane and Perth highest on affordability, cleanliness and being green."

Australia's reputation as a host for international students has been battered in overseas media following violent attacks on Indian students in Melbourne earlier this year and claims others were being exploited by dodgy education providers.

Adelaide ranked well, with Brisbane and Perth, on safety, which IDP said would allow the smaller capitals to play to their strengths in the international market.

"It is hard to argue with a finding that says Sydney and Melbourne have the entertainment and big city attractiveness, but a city with a reputation for being affordable, clean, quiet or green can be just as appealing to families overseas," Mr Pollock said.

State Further Education Minister Michael O'Brien welcomed the survey and said safety was among the top three priorities for international students, along with university rankings and affordability.

"'This puts Adelaide in front of a lot of other cities on one of the most important factors," he said.

Adelaide was rated less favourably in some of the remaining 16 categories of the survey, including outdoor activities, multicultural flavour, dining and shopping.

Education Adelaide ambassador and UniSA student Claudia Fernandez Villasante disagreed with the criticisms of the city.

"I would disagree with the study findings because there are so many things going on here. The public transport is not that bad and there are so many things to do outdoors," the Peruvian national said.

"I agree it is the safest place and it is affordable, and I don't know anyone who has had safety problems, which is good." Fewer students living in Sydney rated it as safe, followed by those in Melbourne, Brisbane and Perth.

Mr O'Brien also dismissed student concerns about the lack of entertainment in Adelaide, saying the world's most prominent university cities were not the largest in their respective countries.

"This would also be a big attraction for many parents overseas who have to dig deep into the pockets and want to send their children somewhere where the bright lights will not be a distraction to their study," he said.

Last month, Federal Education Minister Julia Gillard travelled to India to talk down the racism crisis in the $15.5 billion industry.

The results of the survey will be released today at the Australian International Education Conference in Sydney.

[vik_man]

how the heck is Adelaide not multicultural and why would it rank low on dining when it has the most restaurants per capita

argh, people annoy me.

[Will]

how the heck is Adelaide not multicultural and why would it rank low on dining when it has the most restaurants per capita

argh, people annoy me.

Not just the most restaurants per capita, but also the most award-wining restaurants per capita. In fact the experts all regard Adelaide as a premier food and wine city.

Furhermore, Adelaide also has the most pubs per capita.

Yep, people who make stupid and ignorant comments about Adelaide really piss me off too.