[COM] SkyCity Adelaide Casino Expansion | 55m | 12 Levels | Hotel

[Nort]

Once this is built along with the RAH and HMRI the only exposed bit of rail from North Terrace will be between the HMRI and the bridge. I would not be surprised at all to see that make that spot of land become very appealing for some sort of development over the trainlines.

As I have not seen a map of this development, what I'm about to say is relatively uninformed. I remember that last year, either the Libs or the ALP (I think it was the latter) mentioned something about building a new Casino on the riverfront. Perhaps this area of which Nort speaks could be used for such a thing. Although, I'm sure the land would be quite narrow, so I suppose we could build it upwards, but I can't make an informed statement. Anyone?

Building anything there would be incredibly stupid, as it's the best location for a railway tunnel portal. And if all the other developments go ahead, it will be the only suitable location.

And what good would a new casino do SA anyway?

I agree entirely that site is the best location for the entrance to a train line under the city, given that won't happen for decades however (if ever) it is basically irrelevant in terms of development plans. Think how many other reserved transport corridors have been built on over the years.

As for what good a new casino would do SA? In terms of overall benefit to the state, very little. However the casino is a private business now and it's pretty widely known that Skycity want to move the casino to a new site at some point.

And what good would a new casino do SA anyway?

New casino = larger casino = more gambling = increased gambling taxation revenue.

That argument may have had some validity before the GST was introduced, but I very much doubt it does now. Essentially the government gets a slice of the money whatever people spend it on. But when it's spent on casino gambling, the public get practically nothing in return. Technically it counts as entertainment, but there's nothing entertaining about it when you don't have money at stake.

And without a larger casino, we could instead have more of other forms of gambling, such as spread betting (which indirectly, through the hedging activities of the bookies, has the useful function of increasing liquidity in financial markets) and sports betting (which gets people more interested in sport).

If our casino attracted the international high rollers, it could be different. But even if it expands, it's never going to be in the same league as Melbourne, let alone Vegas or Macau. So we'll lose much more than we gain.

Actually a lot of the casino's revenue goes straight into tax. Being the states only licensed casino comes at a cost.

[spiller]

I would have thought that gambling is only "part" of the equation to justifying a new casino complex as part of this development? anyone who has ever been to the crowne complex in melbourne realises that there is FAR more to do there than just gamble. shopping, dining, entertainment and so on.

[AG]

Cross-posted from the general development thread that Alyx posted this 'Tiser article in:

Adelaide Casino move to Torrens

* Brad Crouch
* From: Sunday Mail (SA)
* July 04, 2010 12:02AM

TORRENS riverbank land immediately west of the Morphett St bridge is the likely site for a new Adelaide Casino.

Relocating to a new purpose-built casino complex overlooking the Torrens Lake is the subject of confidential post-election talks between the State Government and casino management - with both parties bent on progressing the much-talked about riverbank precinct into a "a major tourist and entertainment hub".

A key feature of a new casino complex is likely to be underground parking for several thousand cars, which would potentially solve parking issues for a redeveloped Adelaide Oval.

The Sunday Mail can report:

TREASURER Kevin Foley has confirmed he has been in renewed talks with the casino over a waterfront redevelopment, noting casino management has "exciting ideas".

WATER features and light shows are part of developing plans to turn the Torrens Lake area into an entertainment hub.

DISCUSSIONS have included options for either a boisterous Las Vegas-style resort and a more discreet European-style gambling plaza but the consensus appears to be a more home-grown development incorporating plenty of alfresco dining and walkways to take advantage of the outdoor-friendly climate.

THE LOCATION just west of the Morphett St bridge overlooking the Torrens Lake is regarded as the best site for a new casino-hotel-entertainment venue.

RELOCATING the casino creates new opportunities for transforming the historic Adelaide Railway Station.

Casino general manager David Christian this week said the casino wanted to be part of a new riverside entertainment precinct linked to the redeveloped Adelaide Oval and new Royal Adelaide Hospital in the western railyards.

"Adelaide Casino is one of several major businesses that call the riverbank precinct home and fully supports the idea of turning the area into a major tourist and entertainment hub," Mr Christian said.

"We believe that Adelaide deserves a bigger casino but there is due process to work through before we finalise any plans and present them to the State Government." Mr Foley revealed during a recent business lunch speech he had been in talks with casino management but declined to elaborate on Friday, before heading overseas on a defence trade mission.

He has made a series of speeches recently - speeches which have praised Melbourne's Southbank development, which has the Crown Casino as one of its key attractions.

Last month, Mr Foley told an American Chamber of Commerce lunch the CBD was "underdone".

"We need to be more pro-development," he said.

At another function, he said: "Do we really want to see Adelaide in 10 years' time with a River Torrens precinct that is like going for a stroll in an Outback town where no one has any money or interest in developing something?"

In May 2009, the Sunday Mail reported two construction consortiums were working on plans to present to SkyCity for new casinos at two landmark sites: Either on the Torrens river bank or on the current RAH site.

Casino operator SkyCity Adelaide previously has confirmed it wants to move from the heritage-listed Adelaide Railway Station site into bigger, purpose-built premises incorporating a hotel, with chief executive Nigel Morrison telling investors Adelaide deserved a bigger casino.

In 2008, casino management shelved plans for a $30 million underground car park at its current railway station location, as it looked at "conceptual" plans to relocate.

In 2001, Adelaide developers revealed detailed plans for a $200 million, 22-storey hotel with casino and 240 apartments on the railyards site, and revived them in 2006, but failed to win Government support.

[yousername]

Backwater? Not with a new riverside
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/opin ... 5887527281
Sunday Mail (SA) July 04, 2010 12:02am

GROWING moves to revamp Adelaide's riverside precinct and turn it into a genuine entertainment and tourism hub complete with casino, cafes and walkways present the city a once-in-a-generation opportunity.

That is why it is so important to get it right.

Along with the Royal Adelaide Hospital redevelopment on the railyards and the planned Adelaide Oval upgrade, this is a chance to seize the day and turn Adelaide's limited lakeside area into an exciting pedestrian magnet to be enjoyed by all. Done properly, it would transform Adelaide, just as Melbourne's Southbank development gave new life to that section of the Yarra.

People such as Treasurer Kevin Foley, Urban Development Minister Paul Holloway and the Property Council's George Inglis have let their frustrations flow in recent times with tirades against people who oppose developments. Mr Foley appears to have been softening up the public with vehement attacks on people who would stand in the way of the riverbank's transformation.


Perhaps Mr Foley and Co miss the point.

The good folk of Adelaide may occasionally be a little conservative in their views but are not afraid of embracing change - indeed, this state has been at the forefront of notable social changes over the decades.

However, we have also seen the results of dodgy developments - and borne the cost. Remember the multifunction polis? How about the phallic Capital City tower that was supposed to soar over the city as a diversion from the demise of John Martin's?

The list goes on.

Our citizens have a legitimate right to question developments, probe them, check the pros and cons and voice their opinion. They enjoy a debate. If a project measures up, they will embrace it. Especially if it is done in a transparent, inclusive way, not sprung on them as a fait accompli.

There is a healthy suspicion in this city of people who would concrete the Hills Face Zone, chainsaw ancient trees to build carparks and bulldoze heritage buildings to whack up dog-box apartments to be flogged for a profit. While it is easy to dismiss opponents of developments as "whingers", we have a civic right to ask questions to maintain Adelaide as one of the world's great boutique cities.

The Adelaide Oval redevelopment is a case in point. Even with vigorous questioning Mr Foley was unable to recall - until after the election - warnings of a cost blowout that taxpayers will wear. The Oval plan remains questionable amid concerns that it will be a compromise patch-up.

However, the riverside precinct upgrade could be a different story. If it is planned and presented carefully, it will win the hearts and minds of the public. Just get it right.

[Hooligan]

WATER features and light shows are part of developing plans to turn the Torrens Lake area into an entertainment hub.

I hope the water features and light shows are undercover. I don't want to stand out there in the rain.

I also hope the Torrens Lake is put undercover. Will definently help turn it into an entertainment hub imo.

[Waewick]

this looks promising

[Nathan]

WATER features and light shows are part of developing plans to turn the Torrens Lake area into an entertainment hub.

I hope the water features and light shows are undercover. I don't want to stand out there in the rain.

I also hope the Torrens Lake is put undercover. Will definently help turn it into an entertainment hub imo.

We need some temporary cover too (retractable?) - no way can we settle for the construction crews getting wet whilst they're building the covers over the light shows and lake.

[SRW]

Aside the superficial similarity of being next to a body of water, the riverbank precinct and Melbourne's Southbank are entirely different kettles of fish. If people are going into this with Southbank as an exemplar, we will all be sorely disappointed.

[Stubbo]

Assuming AO goes ahead, the convention centre is expanded and a new casino built west of morphett st along with new hospital, wow, what a centre for significant development.

The suggestion for a new casino in the old RAH site was complete rubbish, a redeveloped river front precinct is exactly where it needs to be.

All that needs to be added to that impressive list of development is a remake of the festival centre and some nice tall appartment buildings to 'flesh it out'

I am quietly crossing my fingers that once the new casino is developed that the old railway building may return to being the interstate railway depot and a small hotel

I must say, I really prefered the Liberal Vision for the Railyards and Torrens, but Labor "seem" to be moving in a very nice direction with the river front and I am quietly excited.

[Waewick]

I hope the counciller is reading this thread (and his first act as mayor ) is to get this through....atleast in a preliminary stage.

Whilst i'd love some more details in prinicipal it sounds fantastic and in reality a commerical entity assisting in the upgrade of the area is a postive.

As for the train station, I agree it should be returned as the interstate arrival point for all trains.

[crawf]

RAH site isn't a bad location for a casino/entertainment complex either.

[Waewick]

yes and no, whilst its near the east end I really don't think it matches the clientèle of the east end and I think a casino is better suited next to the big hotel chains as well.

[Wayno]

If the goal is to invigorate the waterfront district then a casino complex west of morphett st will certainly help. One issue with the Torrens waterfront at the moment is a lack of natural daily foot traffic. A well designed casino complex must encourage a steady flow of people along the waterfront *every day of the week* and in turn create viable business opportunities in that region (restaurants, cafes, stalls, etc). It would be a monumental failure (in my opinion) if a new west-end casino simply funneled people to/fro along north terrace.

Also agree the east-end RAH site is unsuited to a casino - with the hospital moving out it will almost 100% be an 'arts and education precinct' and it seems wrong (some sort of feng shui thing in my mind) to sully the area with gambling. Again just my opinion.

[Stubbo]

...The suggestion for a new casino in the old RAH site was complete rubbish, a redeveloped river front precinct is exactly where it needs to be...

Okay, this might very well be true. But you can't just say so without some kind of supporting argument. If you can then your kitchen is equally suited.

Come on then (playing devil's advocate here):
Why is the Torrens Lake site more suited than the ex-RAH site? Considering that the ex-RAH site is right next to the East End and Rundle Street's restaurant precinct. Where as the Torrens Lake site is in the middle of nowhere pedestrian speaking.

(I'm just trying to raise the level of debate to something well above that of Adelaide-Now. I'd like to see some more thoughtful points made here.)

Challenge accepted!

Random list of points for Torrens lake site:

All major public transport links besides the O-Bahn run in close vicinity to the Torrens facilitating public access

As mentioned previously, close proximity to major hotel chains

Also as mentioned, and one of the major points, it will bring a steady stream of foot traffic to the river front to allow other businesses to then have confidence to flesh out the surrounding areas. Without a steady flow of people eateries and such will not survive and it is crucial to have a good supply of cafes resturants bars etc to support the waterfront area at night time.

It is the Prime location, imagine night shots promoting Adelaide with a redeveloped casino, convention centre and stadium in close proximity around the water front, absolutely stunning. Far better than (although it would still look very nice) overlooking the botanic gardens.

The Casino is a massive player in services / hospitality and will want to be as close to the new stadium (AO) as possible to facilitate as many after and before game patrons as possible. I would argue that having the casino and redeveloped AO as close as possible will cement the previous point regarding public foot traffic to the torrens lake creating that critical mass of people

This is pure speculation but if old RAH buildings are utilised by the Uni's, a casino in the current RAH area would be surroudning by buildings that would have zero night life, contrasting against what a casino should be.

If built on the grounds of the current RAH, significant investment in other developments needs to be undertaken to improve the area to be a centre for entertainment and night life, which it currently is not, compared to the torrens, which has hotels, AO and Festival Centre in close proximity.

I hope that has moved my comment beyond Adelaide Now!!!

I actually read some of there comments yesterday, geez I still can't believe what people say.

I am really looking forward to a revitalised torrens lake area. Exciting times.

[spiller]

Not to mention that a high rise hotel as part of the casino complex in this location would significantly add to the CBD skyline. We could potentially have a new tallest north of North Tce if it were to surpass the Intercontinental (nee Hyatt)! I am all for the casino being included in this development. Not to take things too far off topic, but although I would like to see the Vic Square proposal go ahead, if it were between this development, and that, i'd be backing this every day of the week! If we can have both, then all the better.