Sensational-Adelaide.com

shiftaling wrote:Gouger St as a mall would seem to me to be the perfect solution, if any (main) street in the CBD were a candidate for pedestrianisation it would be Gouger between the square and Morphett.

Given the amount of cars inside the Central Market car park, I doubt the City Council would be very happy with only 1 car park entrance on Grote Street.

I agree though that it should be pedestrianised at some stage, or at least have only restricted access.

Despite its planning though, the State Government is yet to secure funding for CityLINK.

Mullighan told InDaily the Government was still putting together a business case that would be used to apply for funding from Infrastructure Australia.
From: https://indaily.com.au/news/politics/20 ... tram-loop/

I don’t understand. How/why, after so long, has this not been achieved? This should have been submitted before the 2016 federal election!

Norman wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 27, 2018 7:33 pm

shiftaling wrote:Gouger St as a mall would seem to me to be the perfect solution, if any (main) street in the CBD were a candidate for pedestrianisation it would be Gouger between the square and Morphett.

Given the amount of cars inside the Central Market car park, I doubt the City Council would be very happy with only 1 car park entrance on Grote Street.

I agree though that it should be pedestrianised at some stage, or at least have only restricted access.

Maybe it could be made one-way as is rumoured to be in the works for Hindley between KWS and Morphett?

Now if they had built the metro 50 years ago like they should have........................

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rubberman wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:49 pm

[Shuz] wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:19 pm

Gouger and Angas Streets could have a shared tram / car lane. Why is this always immediately ruled out? The mentality seems to be that trams should either have a right of way or no way at all. That doesn't work in most urban environments unless you're building a city from scratch.

This option scored the worst on the multi-factor analysis. However, to answer your point directly, I'd ask the obvious question of why jam up an already busy street, when there's a wider, less busy one a couple of blocks further south? If there were no other options, sure, make it so. However, there's no reason for the big time penalty that Gouger St would involve.

I agree with Shuz. The Angas/Gouger St option is better. Why have a tramline if it's at least 250m from a major CBD destination (Central Market)? The main purpose of such a major investment should be to connect to major destinations WHERE PEOPLE ACTUALLY WANT TO GO. A by-product of this is that it catalyses those areas along the route in terms of redevelopment potential.

The proposed route is rather useless for the majority of people unless you live in the southern part of the CBD. Also if you happen to work anywhere near Waymouth, Pirie, Franklin, Flinders or Grote St (refer to the grey "Capital City Zone" on the CityLINK map), then sorry, the proposed tram route will be of no use to you if you take the train into the CBD or live in the CBD. You will be better off walking as you currently do.

Yes agree that part of Gouger St would be slower with the Angas/Gouger option but I believe people will live with this if the tram takes them right to the heart of a destination.

rubberman wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:17 pm

[Shuz] wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:15 pm

I prefer Option B. Sometimes simpler is better. East Terrace, Angas and Gouger Streets, West Terrace. No weird doglegs, picks up on enough key destinations along the way as well as catalysing potential development sites.

Anxious Street is ok, but Gouger would have to be a mall. There's zero space for trams and cars.

Gouger was discounted from contention to be the E/W bike way route primarily because construction would have impated the Central markets with roadworks restricting the ability of trucks to deliver produce etc for the period of construction. Making Gouger a shared pedestrian/tram mall would have to retain some access routes for delivery trucks.

Kasey771 wrote:Gouger was discounted from contention to be the E/W bike way route primarily because construction would have impated the Central markets with roadworks restricting the ability of trucks to deliver produce etc for the period of construction. Making Gouger a shared pedestrian/tram mall would have to retain some access routes for delivery trucks.

I agree, there are also a lot of events on Gouger Street that would force the closure of the loop when Gouger Street is closed off.

If we had more alternative routes and connections like in Melbourne it may have been ok, but not a network like ours in its infancy.

All good comments, I think it needs to be reinforced that there is a tram stop delivering people right to the market via Vic Sq. Also I think Halifax etc will really benefit from a tram.

shiftaling wrote:All good comments, I think it needs to be reinforced that there is a tram stop delivering people right to the market via Vic Sq. Also I think Halifax etc will really benefit from a tram.

Even more so after the market redevelopment is finished - isn't the Victoria Square entrance supposed to be made much more prominent as part of that? That's smack bang opposite the existing tram stop.

Llessur2002 wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:34 am

shiftaling wrote:All good comments, I think it needs to be reinforced that there is a tram stop delivering people right to the market via Vic Sq. Also I think Halifax etc will really benefit from a tram.

Even more so after the market redevelopment is finished - isn't the Victoria Square entrance supposed to be made much more prominent as part of that? That's smack bang opposite the existing tram stop.

Improving/redeveloping the Market entrance that faces VicSquare would go a long way to addressing concerns raised on this thread I think. It is basically hidden between the Hilton and the beautiful old building on cnr Gouger and Vic square

Llessur2002 wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:34 am

shiftaling wrote:All good comments, I think it needs to be reinforced that there is a tram stop delivering people right to the market via Vic Sq. Also I think Halifax etc will really benefit from a tram.

Even more so after the market redevelopment is finished - isn't the Victoria Square entrance supposed to be made much more prominent as part of that? That's smack bang opposite the existing tram stop.

But unless you live along the King William St route, you would need to change trams (ie wait time for next tram) to get anywhere near the Central Market.

An alternative to get around the Gouger St problem between KW St and Mprphett St is to take the tram along Angas St, then turn right at Vic Square linking to the existing tram line, and then new tramline down Grote St to West Tce. Then you could utilise the existing Vic Square tram stop, and also have a new stop at Chinatown. This would take people where they actually might want to go.

Norman wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:31 am

Kasey771 wrote:Gouger was discounted from contention to be the E/W bike way route primarily because construction would have impated the Central markets with roadworks restricting the ability of trucks to deliver produce etc for the period of construction. Making Gouger a shared pedestrian/tram mall would have to retain some access routes for delivery trucks.

I agree, there are also a lot of events on Gouger Street that would force the closure of the loop when Gouger Street is closed off.

If we had more alternative routes and connections like in Melbourne it may have been ok, but not a network like ours in its infancy.

It's also not on the radar till after 2022 for Labor at least, and unless the Liberals or Mr X announce a version of the loop, it's possibly even further off, 2026 or later. There's a lot that can happen in that time to sway the argument one way or the other. Unless, of course, the Liberals or Mr X have it as an alternative to the Norwood proposal, for example.

Unless that happens, we are talking about something that might happen some time after 2022 at the earliest, and maybe never.

How big would the tram network have to be to make the local construction of trams financially viable? I don't think it will be anywhere near there for years yet, but it's interesting to think about.

Nort wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:54 am

How big would the tram network have to be to make the local construction of trams financially viable? I don't think it will be anywhere near there for years yet, but it's interesting to think about.

I was also interested to know why Adelaide didn't use the trams I've seen in Melbourne, that advertise as being built in Melbourne?

My preferred Cityloop is North Tce - East Tce - Hutt St- Wakefield St - Victoria Square - Grote St - West Tce. The Grote St tracks could be used/continue to Sir Donald Bradman Drive to the airport. It covers Chinatown and has the widest streets. Anyone know if this was [or why it wasn't] considered? Also the Norwood route from Rundle St through Kent Town [via The Parade West - opp PAC] is a dog-legged, dogs breakfast. With the tram I expect them to remove all off street parking which will make things even worse for businesses/people around there. Is there any other better route/option to get from Rundle St to the Parade?