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I thought the Liberals were all about fixing the economy, I thought Abbott and Hockey were going to save the day because Australia was a ship wreck floating aimlessly out at sea because of Labors alleged economic mismanagement?

Instead of 100-150 million in funding to Holden, they now have the task of providing over a billion(in Adelaide alone) in assistance to the regions affected..not to mention unemployment benefits to those who wont be able to find work, and there will be many. Will they provide funding for retraining of 100,000 people?


Hmm..I dunno, but maybe I'm reading things upside down...maybe spending 1 billion + is a better option then spending a 100-150 million and keeping 100,000 people in a job. I'm not an economist, nor do I know everything, like weekwika the perfect over there...so what do I know..besides the simple facts before us.
Maybe I should take to spreading Liberal coalition propaganda on Internet forums, claim I'm some big shot whose paid to think outside the box, and chase people around Internet forums harassing them like some obsessed school girl with a crush.

Lets not even talk about the socio-economic impact this will have on a region with high unemployment already(over 40% youth unemployment alone). I mean, they are just bottom of the barrel working class folk right..they don't wear a designer shirt to work everyday and walk around with a coffee in their hand and their head up their ass like some people around here..so tough luck for them I guess. As some peoples hero Abbott says..."things just happen sometimes"..

how many active users are there on these boards? I would count a dozen? I'm hardly chasing you around harassing. If you don't like people posting an opposite view point I'd suggest simply not posting.

Waewick wrote:

how many active users are there on these boards? I would count a dozen? I'm hardly chasing you around harassing. If you don't like people posting an opposite view point I'd suggest simply not posting.

Nothing wrong with an opposing view, you arrogant fool.
Present an opposing view, not your delusions and personal jibes.

Now piss off.

Why not convert the entire factory grounds into a theme park!
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/opin ... 6782391372

Or as a venue for the 2020 Adelaide World Expo.
Or more importantly, bulldoze the lot and maybe it could be its future home of the 2036 Adelaide Olympics!

rev wrote:

Waewick wrote:

how many active users are there on these boards? I would count a dozen? I'm hardly chasing you around harassing. If you don't like people posting an opposite view point I'd suggest simply not posting.

Nothing wrong with an opposing view, you arrogant fool.
Present an opposing view, not your delusions and personal jibes.

Now piss off.

Isn't calling someone an arrogant fool a personal jibe?

But I'll stay away from responding to you.

The demise of Holden is sad news, from the point of losing another iconic Australian brand, but maybe, just possibly, it could be a blessing in disguise to this state. The Federal government is now locked in to spending hundreds of millions in this state, much of it on much needed infrastructure and also to diversify manufacturing here. We had become obesessed with saving Holden, and yes, many thousands who lose their jobs, and may never find well payed employment again. however, what is yet to be calculated is the new opportunites that will become available in the next decade of increased infrastructure spending and new jobs created in other industries such as defence and mining services, supported by decent efficient roads, rail and ports, rather than just shovelling money off to Detroit to prop up that bankrupt city, and paying 1300 production line workers well above the average wage.

claybro wrote:The demise of Holden is sad news, from the point of losing another iconic Australian brand, but maybe, just possibly, it could be a blessing in disguise to this state. The Federal government is now locked in to spending hundreds of millions in this state, much of it on much needed infrastructure and also to diversify manufacturing here. We had become obesessed with saving Holden, and yes, many thousands who lose their jobs, and may never find well payed employment again. however, what is yet to be calculated is the new opportunites that will become available in the next decade of increased infrastructure spending and new jobs created in other industries such as defence and mining services, supported by decent efficient roads, rail and ports, rather than just shovelling money off to Detroit to prop up that bankrupt city, and paying 1300 production line workers well above the average wage.

hear hear.

It would be great if both sides of politics could de politise this and try and get a common footing on the plan forward.

claybro wrote:The demise of Holden is sad news, from the point of losing another iconic Australian brand, but maybe, just possibly, it could be a blessing in disguise to this state. The Federal government is now locked in to spending hundreds of millions in this state, much of it on much needed infrastructure and also to diversify manufacturing here. We had become obesessed with saving Holden, and yes, many thousands who lose their jobs, and may never find well payed employment again. however, what is yet to be calculated is the new opportunites that will become available in the next decade of increased infrastructure spending and new jobs created in other industries such as defence and mining services, supported by decent efficient roads, rail and ports, rather than just shovelling money off to Detroit to prop up that bankrupt city, and paying 1300 production line workers well above the average wage.

Well above the average wage? Mate, the average wage at Holdens is something like 45-48,000, the state average is something like 50,000. Some Liberals are of the opinion that they should only be getting a third of that for the work they do.
And let's not pretend like we don't all know that the Liberal party is more interested in looking after their mates in big business then they are in looking after and securing Australian jobs. Holdens closing is a classic example of how the Liberal party does not give a toss about the Australian worker.

This isn't just about Holden closing production in Australia. It is also about the tens of thousands of people who are employed at component manufacturers around Australia. The total amount of people affected by Holden closing, could exceed 100,000. Our state economy is going to take a big hit as a result of this.
Lets assume 3/4 of those people do not find work within the first year. The average dole payment is around $250 a week I believe. That's $13,000 a year for 75,000 people. That's $975 million in dole payments in one year. Remind me again how much it would have cost to maintain Labors plan to assist the car industry? 500 million over the space of a few years? Even if only half don't find work in the first year, that's still over $600 million.
Then throw in the 1 billion dollars that it's estimated by experts(was in advertiser) that the north of Adelaide will require in assistance now. And who knows how much more money is going to be needed to help other communities and regions around Australia who will be affected.
We are talking many billions of dollars. Of course I'm sure Abbott will find a way to do it on the cheap without really helping most of those affected.

Where is the plan to help those people? Tony Abbott still mulling things over with that slimy slug Hockey who spent an entire election campaign bashing Labor about debt, and then when he gets into the Treasurers seat goes and abolishes the debt ceiling? Of course when they run debt up to a trillion dollars, it'll be Labors fault naturally.

What infrastructure spending? Abbott has cut funding for the Torrens to Torrens section. We still haven't heard anything on his promise for Darlington.
The federal government isn't locked into spending anything extra in South Australia. What makes you think they will now spend extra money in SA on infrastructure? Has there been some announcement?

Why did they sit on their hands and basically challenge Holden to close down, and now suddenly they are talking about being ready to help Toyota and provide assistance? We are being duped by these assholes and some people actually think they give a shit about us common folk. But then again some of us claim to be paid to think outside the box while we walk around sipping their coffee from some coffee franchise.

The next state election is shaping up to be Weatherill vs Abbott.
Steven whats his name has become irrelevant in one of the biggest issues this state has faced in years. No surprise really.

What new jobs in mining and defence? Where are these jobs going to come from? Which companies are expanding? Which companies are moving in? Is Tony Abbott going to commit to building 12 new submarines at Osborne? How about a fourth destroyer which was talked about a while before the election? No? At least 45,000 people will soon be out of a job. Where are these 45,000 new jobs? Whose going to pay to retrain these people? Abbott? Abbott didn't even want to fork out 100-150 million to save their jobs..he's now going to spend more then that to retrain them and help them get new jobs? That would be a surprise.

Tony Abbott talking about Olympic Dam's expansion possibly going ahead is just a tactic to deflect attention from his monumental SCREW UP. The locals aren't going to vote his state counterparts in if they wake up to the fact that federal Libs have screwed the state over by allowing Holden to close. Especially when they realize how little it could have cost to keep 100,000 people employed, compared to how much it's going to cost with Holden closing to "fix" the surge in unemployment.
When BHP didn't go ahead with ODX, they did say it was still going to happen eventually. So what's Abbott on about? Has he got some insider knowledge? Perhaps we should take it as a hint and invest in BHP shares now?

First Mitsubishi, then Ford, now Holden. Toyota wont be far off. And lets not forget the countless other manufacturers in other industries which have been lost. Our governments have screwed and condemned our manufacturing by putting us on an even playing field with the rest of the world, now we can't do shit about it or we get taken to court and fined by the WTO. That's the real scoop here that is being ignored, not so much that another manufacturer is closing it's doors.
Our governments Labor or Liberal have been doing very little and continue to do nothing to protect Australian industries and jobs.
How many people employed by Sheridan these days? A few dozen under the umbrella of Pacific Brands? Their factory on the St Clair site at Woodville used to employ over 1,000 people. BUT THEY ARE STILL EMPLOYING SOME PEOPLE TO MOVE SOME BOXES AROUND SO THATS GOOD NEWS YEH??!! Lets rejoice.

Manufacturing is a strategic asset to a nation. I'll let you all think about on what that means for your selves.

Rev, give them a chance mate... holden announcement was what ...3 days ago??? As for the average wage comment, I was comparing the average wage of a holden production line worker over the average wage of a similar manufacturing job in other industries. WAY HIGHER!
This has been a field day for the Abbot haters...and fair enough, it fell on his watch. However, general political public sentiment seems to be that Abbot is no more responsible for this that was Julia/Rudd and the carbon tax. Public sentiment also seems to be that we were becoming tired of GMC bleating about how they were doing us all a favour staying here and "please send more money"! Complete with the silky smooth American mouthpiece playing a role any double agent would be proud of. Suffice to say, if Australians where desperate to keep Holden, we would have been buying them instead of cheap imports, so then we really have to look at who started the whole dropping of automotive tarrifs and blame them.?....this situation goes way back, over many governments and many agreements.
Most fair minded people are looking beyond the political point scoring, and realise GM were playing us, the unions where getting what they could while they could for their members, and the whole song had to come to an end sooner rather than later. What most of us now will be watching, is what we get in return for this loss from the federal government, and with a state election looming, Steven Marshal should be praying ,that from his mate Tony, it will be significant!

But Claybro, if you were listening to Liberal MP's, you'd have thought that they knew Holden was closing in advance. They were convinced it was a sure thing.
GM Holden was asking for money. Abbott government wasn't prepared to give them money. So the smart thing would be to prepare for the eventual closure of the Holden plants in Australia. They haven't prepared, even though they were saying it will be announced before Christmas. Why haven't they prepared?

They've been saying that the writings been on the wall for Holden for a long time now. If that's their opinion, they would have/should have gone into the election with at least a rough plan/idea of what they will do in the event Holden does close its doors. But they have got no plan or policies. And that should scare you more then 100,000 people losing their jobs. We aren't talking about a single factory or two. But dozens of businesses. And if this is how they deal with that...then how are they going to deal with other issues? I wonder how they will deal with Chinese and Indonesian fishing boats coming into Australian national waters because they've depleted their own stocks..probably the same reactions..."these things just happen"..

They have entire teams of advisors and assistants..they could have conjured up some basic plan to get the ball rolling as quickly as possible. Instead they've done nothing, no contingency plans, nothing. Oh but suddenly they've announced(after the closure announcement on Holden) that they are prepared to provide assistance to help Toyota stay open. Why not provide assistance to keep Holden open? Why isn't anyone paying attention to the bullshit?
They are ready to help Toyota, but couldn't be bothered helping Holden..WHAT THE F*** is going on?

Unfortunately, since they've got the media on side, they've been able to sell the bullshit about costs being too high to make things here, "these things happen" and whatever other bs they are selling the public, so peoples heads are filled with crap, and not enough people are asking the questions that matter. How many listen to talk back radio? many of these issues are raised on there by the hosts..unfortunately not enough people are listening to facts they are giving us. Because hey, the Foxtels still working, the footy season will still go ahead, and the beer will still be sold.

How quickly did they move on the NBN...how quickly did they fix it up so their mates in Telstra benefit?

So either they had something planned before the election with Telstra, or they are just incompetent when it comes to Holden..

Even if Steven Marshall wins the state election, mate we will be lucky to see any extra funding for the state. Steven Marshall lacks the testicular capability to fight for South Australia and it's people.
He's gone missing in action when tens of thousands of South Aussies are about to lose their jobs. Party politics should have been put aside and he should have been standing shoulder to shoulder with the Premier doing everything they can for South Australia and our economy.
Instead Steven Marshall did nothing, when it was too late he booked a flight to Canberra to see Abbott..days after Weatherill had planned to go see him. Why the delay? He is just as incompetent and useless as the rest of the sad mob who have been chosen to lead the state Liberals for a long time now. And even when he did/does meet with Abbott, Marshall will probably me more likely to talk about how they can put a spin on this to make them both look good so he can win the election, rather then talk about what can be done for South Australia, and demand better results and outcomes for the state from the feds.

All he has done is spew out the same bullshit rhetoric as his federal pals. "These things just happen, oh well, blah blah blah"
Imagine this guy as our states leader.

He wants to be our states premier, yet he can't find his pair to stand up for South Australia and South Australians when it matters most.

I'm not out for political point scoring..my posts are also critical of Labor governments in the past as well as Liberal. They are all to blame.
When the UK, Germany, Japan, South Korea, and the USA can all continue to make cars and export them, then you have our politicians telling us we can't do the same in Australia, you know there's a rat in the house.
Something stinks. And it's our politicians.

claybro wrote:The demise of Holden is sad news, from the point of losing another iconic Australian brand, but maybe, just possibly, it could be a blessing in disguise to this state. The Federal government is now locked in to spending hundreds of millions in this state, much of it on much needed infrastructure and also to diversify manufacturing here. We had become obesessed with saving Holden, and yes, many thousands who lose their jobs, and may never find well payed employment again. however, what is yet to be calculated is the new opportunites that will become available in the next decade of increased infrastructure spending and new jobs created in other industries such as defence and mining services, supported by decent efficient roads, rail and ports, rather than just shovelling money off to Detroit to prop up that bankrupt city, and paying 1300 production line workers well above the average wage.

well I do hope you are right, I am interested in what this Abbott federal govt is going to do for our state to cover for expected job losses. So far it appears his plan is to spend zero on anything in SA simply because we have a state labor govt, and has to revenge us for this. If these federal liberal idiots can realise they are not in opposition but actually running the country we may get somewhere, but atm all they are interested in is blaming everything on the previous govt and trashing the labor brand.

Well, lets see..Abbott has agreed with state/territory leaders on a package for assistance. Let's see what it is.

And Weatherill has given Abbott a list of 'demands', saying money needs to flow into SA now. Lets see if Abbott takes that on board and provides funds, or if he tries to use it to help his state colleagues win a state election when they are clearly incompetent.

Naturally the West Australians are saying the feds should instead focus on the resources sector. Of course because they've got all of Australia's interests at heart, and not just their own.

rev wrote:Naturally the West Australians are saying the feds should instead focus on the resources sector. Of course because they've got all of Australia's interests at heart, and not just their own.

The West Australians are right on this, and not for the cyinical reasons you might think. Had the Olympic dam expansion proceeded, we would have been completely un-prepared both in workforce and infrastrucutre. At best Adelaide would have been a giant flyin fly out staging port for for people and materials in the short term.The resource services industry provides a wide range of jobs, services and skills, and as a state we should now focus on this, not only to service states like WA, but also for when inevitably, BHP need what is buried in our outback. With a hopeful massive increase in money to be spent here from the Federal government (not just sent off to Detriot) now is our opportunity to make this happen, and be ready for a massive increase in mining activity that will prove Holden to be the storm in a teacup it once was.

45,000-100,000 jobs is a storm in a tea cup?

Anyway, why must we replace one industry with another? Why not multiple?
Aren't we forever hearing how we must diversify our economy? And here politicians and citizens alike are saying "it's ok, everything will be alright, just go get a job in a mine"...

When we no longer have the capabilities to build anything in Australia, and we are paying an arm and a leg(Even more so then we are now) for the things which we once produced our selves, then you might understand why manufacturing is a strategic asset. Or do you think that in the decades ahead we will all become billionaires and buying a car, a washing machine, or a fridge will be like pocket change?

Fact is we are screwed. We have been screwed by past governments.
The current government could have done something to save Holden. But it did not. Now oddly it wants to save Toyota.
Oh well, shame really that SA, Vic and NSW(who has quite a few component makers) couldn't come together and make up the shortfall in the $500 million package that the Liberal feds pulled the plug on.

rev wrote:45,000-100,000 jobs is a storm in a tea cup?

Anyway, why must we replace one industry with another? Why not multiple?
Aren't we forever hearing how we must diversify our economy? And here politicians and citizens alike are saying "it's ok, everything will be alright, just go get a job in a mine"...

When we no longer have the capabilities to build anything in Australia, and we are paying an arm and a leg(Even more so then we are now) for the things which we once produced our selves, then you might understand why manufacturing is a strategic asset. Or do you think that in the decades ahead we will all become billionaires and buying a car, a washing machine, or a fridge will be like pocket change?

Fact is we are screwed. We have been screwed by past governments.
The current government could have done something to save Holden. But it did not. Now oddly it wants to save Toyota.
Oh well, shame really that SA, Vic and NSW(who has quite a few component makers) couldn't come together and make up the shortfall in the $500 million package that the Liberal feds pulled the plug on.

Rev, the job loss figures quoted are assuming there is no action taken by government to stimulate the economy and create new industries. Why must we replace one industry with another??? Well the industry that is closing was completely unsustainable. Why not multiple?? Well there is every indication this will provide the impetus to create or strengthen multiple other sustainable industries which will in turn create many thousands of jobs. The challenge for the Federal government will be to direct any stimulus spending toward long term sustainable projects which was something sadly lacking from the former government. Will this government have the courage to go the long goal and not just quick hush money??? well they are now on notice.