Sensational-Adelaide.com

SBD wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 14, 2020 7:30 pm

[Shuz] wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:49 am

Rollercoaster Freeway.

Does anyone really get sick from the undulations in T2T and Superway? The Southern Expressway has much bigger hills by following the topography. I don't know why they are on the Superway, but I imagine the trenches are easier to manage stormwater with a few places to pump out from. The Northern Connector is fairly flat, and the Northern Expressway has two "bumps" for bridges over the railway line and Gawler River. Nobody really complains about going under Anzac Highway then over Cross Road either.

As if you've actually put that much thought into this..

NTRabbit wrote:Even with Urbanstone gone I don't see how they can stay at grade and keep both the cemetery and the brickworks, the turn would be too tight

My mother theorised that the government had been buying up/not renewing plots in the cemetery.

rev wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 15, 2020 9:51 pm

SBD wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 14, 2020 7:30 pm

[Shuz] wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:49 am

Rollercoaster Freeway.

Does anyone really get sick from the undulations in T2T and Superway? The Southern Expressway has much bigger hills by following the topography. I don't know why they are on the Superway, but I imagine the trenches are easier to manage stormwater with a few places to pump out from. The Northern Connector is fairly flat, and the Northern Expressway has two "bumps" for bridges over the railway line and Gawler River. Nobody really complains about going under Anzac Highway then over Cross Road either.

As if you've actually put that much thought into this..

Somebody had a reason for designing it as it is. The elevated motorway would be simpler and easier to design and manufacture at one height, so I conclude there is a reason, even though I don't know what it is.

While we're discussing theories, it is possible they might go a bit wider to the west to allow room for both the parallel roads and tunnel portal with the design speeds and engineering standards to allow an appropriate curvature of the motorway at 80-90kph.

This could be done as follows;

From Gawler Avenue with property acquisition of 28 properties including 28 to 60 Jervois Avenue, Langman Reserve, Urbanstone Central and 1 through to 12 Torrens Avenue. There is about a 6 metre slither of land adjacent Brickworks between Ashwin Parade and the River Torrens and a far bit of room between the Brickworks kiln at the back, which would allow room for a new bridge.

I can't see them encroaching on Hindmarsh Cemetery as I believe some of the plots are state heritage listed. Not to mention the sensitivities associated with digging up graves, which is never a good look in any major infrastructure project - I think they have learnt their lesson from the Southern Expressway duplication.

SBD wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:23 pm

rev wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 15, 2020 9:51 pm

SBD wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 14, 2020 7:30 pm

Does anyone really get sick from the undulations in T2T and Superway? The Southern Expressway has much bigger hills by following the topography. I don't know why they are on the Superway, but I imagine the trenches are easier to manage stormwater with a few places to pump out from. The Northern Connector is fairly flat, and the Northern Expressway has two "bumps" for bridges over the railway line and Gawler River. Nobody really complains about going under Anzac Highway then over Cross Road either.

As if you've actually put that much thought into this..

Somebody had a reason for designing it as it is. The elevated motorway would be simpler and easier to design and manufacture at one height, so I conclude there is a reason, even though I don't know what it is.

An elevated expressway through the inner suburbs would not be accepted in Adelaide. Noise issues, visual issues.. Adelaide is very flat, and an elevated road stands out like a giant scar. it just would never happen. Fine in Wingfield where it is industrial for miles around.. but inner west? No way. On that point I do think the tunnel through Melrose Park is overkill, where a trench would suffice, but hey.. the tunnel will be less disruptive, and people seem happy with the ugly mess that is South Road downn there.. so it gets to stay that way.

I'm still trying to work out what the possibilities are going to be in regards to the new tunnel at cross road.

a) will there be full entry/exit from the tunnel at cross road? if so will this mean the existing railway line remains at grade or will the railway line need to go above the surface roads/entry exit points?

b) does the tunnel completely bypass the cross road intersection therefore remaining mostly unchanged?

aceman wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:08 pm

I'm still trying to work out what the possibilities are going to be in regards to the new tunnel at cross road.

a) will there be full entry/exit from the tunnel at cross road? if so will this mean the existing railway line remains at grade or will the railway line need to go above the surface roads/entry exit points?

b) does the tunnel completely bypass the cross road intersection therefore remaining mostly unchanged?

What makes you think there's going to be a tunnel at Cross Road?
The statement on the DPTI site says that there will also be overpasses and underpasses, as well as lowered motorway and surface motorway elements.

My guess is the northern tunnel will end before the Gallipoli underpass and the southern tunnel will end before the Emerson bridge.

There will probably be a lowered motorway that comes out of the southern end of the northern tunnel and continues into a widened Gallipoli underpass. Maybe the Emerson bridge will be rebuilt 3 lanes each way, and the train line will be sunk under Cross road/South road intersection? then a short surface motorway before the southern tunnel.

Or perhaps the lowered motorway will continue under Cross Road and onto the southern tunnel, and the rail line will go above the intersection.

Survey work involving theodolites was being conducted late last night around the intersection with James Congdon Road.

rev wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:34 am

aceman wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:08 pm

I'm still trying to work out what the possibilities are going to be in regards to the new tunnel at cross road.

a) will there be full entry/exit from the tunnel at cross road? if so will this mean the existing railway line remains at grade or will the railway line need to go above the surface roads/entry exit points?

b) does the tunnel completely bypass the cross road intersection therefore remaining mostly unchanged?

What makes you think there's going to be a tunnel at Cross Road?
The statement on the DPTI site says that there will also be overpasses and underpasses, as well as lowered motorway and surface motorway elements.

My guess is the northern tunnel will end before the Gallipoli underpass and the southern tunnel will end before the Emerson bridge.

There will probably be a lowered motorway that comes out of the southern end of the northern tunnel and continues into a widened Gallipoli underpass. Maybe the Emerson bridge will be rebuilt 3 lanes each way, and the train line will be sunk under Cross road/South road intersection? then a short surface motorway before the southern tunnel.

Or perhaps the lowered motorway will continue under Cross Road and onto the southern tunnel, and the rail line will go above the intersection.

I was under the impression that the southern tunnel will finish just south of the tram line which means it will continue past cross road unless I interpreted it incorrectly.

aceman wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:25 pm

I was under the impression that the southern tunnel will finish just south of the tram line which means it will continue past cross road unless I interpreted it incorrectly.

Yeah that's right, although the FAQ on the DPTI website talks about them still deciding where the tunnel will have exits and entry points etc. so I think Cross Road will be very much on the table still. Basically I think the big takeway is there's a lot of planning still to do

Whilst this is an exciting project and will transform Adelaide road network, I think we still need to remember that any images or videos are just concepts. Final design is still a fair way off and wont be concluded until the end of next year at the earliest.

Latest timeline can been seen at 29 minute mark here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRaPGzc ... e=youtu.be

There is still a lot of consultation and design work to do. No doubt there will be significant change to what we see now and what will actually be delivered.

aceman wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:25 pm

rev wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:34 am

aceman wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:08 pm

I'm still trying to work out what the possibilities are going to be in regards to the new tunnel at cross road.

a) will there be full entry/exit from the tunnel at cross road? if so will this mean the existing railway line remains at grade or will the railway line need to go above the surface roads/entry exit points?

b) does the tunnel completely bypass the cross road intersection therefore remaining mostly unchanged?

What makes you think there's going to be a tunnel at Cross Road?
The statement on the DPTI site says that there will also be overpasses and underpasses, as well as lowered motorway and surface motorway elements.

My guess is the northern tunnel will end before the Gallipoli underpass and the southern tunnel will end before the Emerson bridge.

There will probably be a lowered motorway that comes out of the southern end of the northern tunnel and continues into a widened Gallipoli underpass. Maybe the Emerson bridge will be rebuilt 3 lanes each way, and the train line will be sunk under Cross road/South road intersection? then a short surface motorway before the southern tunnel.

Or perhaps the lowered motorway will continue under Cross Road and onto the southern tunnel, and the rail line will go above the intersection.

I was under the impression that the southern tunnel will finish just south of the tram line which means it will continue past cross road unless I interpreted it incorrectly.

Wasn't aware of that. Where did you see/read this?

rev wrote:

aceman wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:25 pm

rev wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:34 am

What makes you think there's going to be a tunnel at Cross Road?
The statement on the DPTI site says that there will also be overpasses and underpasses, as well as lowered motorway and surface motorway elements.

My guess is the northern tunnel will end before the Gallipoli underpass and the southern tunnel will end before the Emerson bridge.

There will probably be a lowered motorway that comes out of the southern end of the northern tunnel and continues into a widened Gallipoli underpass. Maybe the Emerson bridge will be rebuilt 3 lanes each way, and the train line will be sunk under Cross road/South road intersection? then a short surface motorway before the southern tunnel.

Or perhaps the lowered motorway will continue under Cross Road and onto the southern tunnel, and the rail line will go above the intersection.

I was under the impression that the southern tunnel will finish just south of the tram line which means it will continue past cross road unless I interpreted it incorrectly.

Wasn't aware of that. Where did you see/read this?

https://indaily.com.au/news/2020/11/10/ ... orth-south

“The project includes:

-A 4.3km southern tunnel from Darlington to just south of the Glenelg Tram bridge
-1km of lowered motorway under the Glenelg Tram line and Anzac Highway”

NYG wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 4:35 pm

rev wrote:

aceman wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:25 pm

I was under the impression that the southern tunnel will finish just south of the tram line which means it will continue past cross road unless I interpreted it incorrectly.

Wasn't aware of that. Where did you see/read this?

https://indaily.com.au/news/2020/11/10/ ... orth-south

“The project includes:

-A 4.3km southern tunnel from Darlington to just south of the Glenelg Tram bridge
-1km of lowered motorway under the Glenelg Tram line and Anzac Highway”

Is that confirmed though? Because I had a look at the DPTI project page and can't find that mentioned, or I'm blind.

Years ago, there were plans for a southern suburbs O-Bahn. Well, this motorway is just as good! What are the plans for bus routes to use the motorway? This could drastically speed up bus routes from the southern suburbs, such as Aberfoyle Park and Morphett Vale. At the moment, those bus routes are horribly slow, so they are also infrequent and hardly anyone takes them. There will still need to be South Road buses, but the buses from these distant southern suburbs should be taking the motorway.

There needs to be a way for buses to enter the city from the motorway. If James Congdon Drive has access to the motorway, then a right turn could be installed at Sir Donald Bradman Drive making bus access to the city easy. This could be combined with my Keswick Creek O-Bahn idea too: https://www.sensational-adelaide.com/fo ... 89#p195989