The Federal Politics Thread

[Waewick]

A donkey vote is still a formal vote.

I'm talking about an informal vote. A vote where I draw cartoons, write my own name down, mark all the candidates 1, don't mark the ballot paper at all, etc.

still, why bother - it is a waste of a very unique power you have that at last count 600 people in Egypt have died for.

[[Shuz]]

A donkey vote is still a formal vote.

I'm talking about an informal vote. A vote where I draw cartoons, write my own name down, mark all the candidates 1, don't mark the ballot paper at all, etc.

Still, why bother - it is a waste of a very unique power you have that at last count 600 people in Egypt have died for.

You consider it a waste, I consider it my democratic right to lodge an informal vote as I please. And please don't compare the situation in Egypt to here - its apples and oranges.

As a libertarian, I believe that noone should ever be forced to vote and despise the idea of compulsory voting. It should be voluntary. People have a right to vote, but they also have a right not to. Further to this, even if I did want to vote, I shouldn't have to preference every single candidate. We should have a system of optional preferential voting (OPV) in place. Power should be placed directly in the hands of the people, and only with the people. Not in the hands of politicans making back door preference deals between respective parties.

[Norman]

I would consider voting Liberal if Andrew Southcott was more pro-active within the community (I have never seen him in the 13 years I have lived within his electorate) and if the party was not so anti-public transport.

[Waewick]

A donkey vote is still a formal vote.

I'm talking about an informal vote. A vote where I draw cartoons, write my own name down, mark all the candidates 1, don't mark the ballot paper at all, etc.

Still, why bother - it is a waste of a very unique power you have that at last count 600 people in Egypt have died for.

You consider it a waste, I consider it my democratic right to lodge an informal vote as I please. And please don't compare the situation in Egypt to here - its apples and oranges.

As a libertarian, I believe that noone should ever be forced to vote and despise the idea of compulsory voting. It should be voluntary. People have a right to vote, but they also have a right not to. Further to this, even if I did want to vote, I shouldn't have to preference every single candidate. We should have a system of optional preferential voting (OPV) in place. Power should be placed directly in the hands of the people, and only with the people. Not in the hands of politicans making back door preference deals between respective parties.

I don't agree with preferential voting either.

I might be a bit extreme in my thinking (and please don't take this as a personal attack, I don't mean that at all) perhaps we need to remind people of their position of power in voting, firstly removing their right to vote if they don't and then maybe linking citizenship to it, i.e don't vote lose citizenship?

It just drives me nuts listening to apathetic Australians about their "rights not to vote" but in the same breath then complain about who is in power.

don't get me wrong It isn't just an Australian thing, I have friends in America who don't vote and then won't shut up about how much they don't like who is in power.

[Waewick]

I would consider voting Liberal if Andrew Southcott was more pro-active within the community (I have never seen him in the 13 years I have lived within his electorate) and if the party was not so anti-public transport.

I think my sitting member is Kate Ellis.

My wife thinks highly, but I've never met her.

[[Shuz]]

Kate Ellis has sex appeal.

I certainly don't agree with your view at all Waewick, so we shall agree to disagree?

[ouchjars]

I would consider voting Liberal if Andrew Southcott was more pro-active within the community (I have never seen him in the 13 years I have lived within his electorate) and if the party was not so anti-public transport.

The only time I've seen him around was the day after the election was called, putting up posters.

[monotonehell]

As a libertarian,

And with those three words you just lost all credibility.

There are some good points you can take from libertarianism, right now in the western world we have several problems with government. I even share some of the stances libertarians promote. But taken to its extreme libertarianism is unworkable, like any of the isms. No one philosophy can be applied across all situations. It's a folly to stand on one platform as a one size fits all solution. We had over 100 years of radical political thought, where all kinds of isms were tried. None of them work. You need to be more pragmatic and look at the situations you face to find a solution.

In all the discussions with people who label themselves such I find two truths: They don't want to pay tax and they have no idea how society works.

I believe that noone should ever be forced to vote and despise the idea of compulsory voting. It should be voluntary. People have a right to vote, but they also have a right not to. Further to this, even if I did want to vote, I shouldn't have to preference every single candidate. We should have a system of optional preferential voting (OPV) in place. Power should be placed directly in the hands of the people, and only with the people. Not in the hands of politicans making back door preference deals between respective parties.

Wrong. You are not forced to vote. You are forced to appear and get your name crossed off as having voted. This is an important safeguard so that voter fraud, voter intimidation and other wrongdoings don't occur as we see them in so many other countries. A preferential system is also important for proper representation. You have a choice, vote above the line and let your chosen candidate allocate your vote to their preference, or vote below the line and YOU chose your preferences.

[claybro]

Given how many people in the world die for the right to vote, it really disheartens me to hear people complaining about having to vote. Our system is far from perfect, our politicians sometimes embarrassing, our party of choice may not win. But please, please consider the alternatives that are on offer throughout the world. People went to war to fight for our way of life. Many died. The least we can do is not be apathetic, get of our collective arse and exercise our free democratic right.

[monotonehell]

Here's a cartoon explaining preferential voting for the TL;DR crowd...
http://chickennation.com/website_stuff/ ... -IMAGE.png

[Dog]

NBN

[rev]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/factcheck/


One that stands out to me is the one on Debt.

Claim:
Joe Hockey claimed the Howard gov. left $70 billion in net assets when it left office, and if Libs are elected again will inherit $400 billion in debt(projections till 2017)

Fact:
Howard gov. left $31 billion net assets.
Net debt projection till 2017 is $217 billion.

[zippySA]

Putting exaggeration aside - those figures are still pretty amazing (in a scary way).

Fact is, Australia didn't avoid the GFC, we simply were in the right place at the right time - a country without debt at the start. I hate the way politicians compare us to other economy's and say how well we are doing because our debt is smaller than the rest - we are "the lucky country" and we should be managed in such a way that we retain the values and life-style that we believe important and relevant - and just because our debt is smaller than others, isn't something to be proud of. We should have solid, clear leadership and a Government focussed on the best outcomes for us all in Australia - so we can continue to be the luckiest country in the world.

[[Shuz]]

Even if we did have no surplus in the final budget / year before the GFC hit, we would still have one of the lowest debt /deficits in the OECD countries?

[Aidan]

Putting exaggeration aside - those figures are still pretty amazing (in a scary way).

The debt itself is not a problem, but amazement and fear of the figures are s very big problem.

Fact is, Australia didn't avoid the GFC, we simply were in the right place at the right time - a country without debt at the start.

Before you start saying what the facts are, you should check them! The GFC did hit Australia, but we escaped most of its effects because of the stimulus.

It had absolutely nothing to do with debt. We own the Reserve Bank, so can always afford a stimulus no matter how high our debt is.

And (contrary to another common myth) nor was due to China - commodity prices were low at the time and it was only afterwards that Chinese demand picked up.

I hate the way politicians compare us to other economy's and say how well we are doing because our debt is smaller than the rest - we are "the lucky country" and we should be managed in such a way that we retain the values and life-style that we believe important and relevant - and just because our debt is smaller than others, isn't something to be proud of. We should have solid, clear leadership and a Government focussed on the best outcomes for us all in Australia - so we can continue to be the luckiest country in the world.

I too hate it, because although it's true it distracts us from how much better things could be - our unemployment rate could be half what it is now if the economy were better managed. But the problem isn't the deficits - indeed trying to rush back to surplus would make it much much worse. The problem is the Reserve Bank set interest rates much too high, which wrecked economic growth, pushed the dollar too high for much of our industry to successfully compete internationally, and was the real reason our net debt ballooned.